|FROM ||From: "Steve Milo"
|SUBJECT ||Re: [hangout] leeches=$(diff Free_Software Open_Source)
|From owner-hangout-desteny-at-mrbrklyn.com Sat Jan 17 08:44:30 2004
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From: "Steve Milo"
To: Adam Kosmin
Date: Sat, 17 Jan 2004 09:47:42 -0400
X-Mailer: Netscape Webmail
Subject: Re: [hangout] leeches=$(diff Free_Software Open_Source)
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Reply-To: "Steve Milo"
List: New Yorker GNU Linux Scene
Admin: To unsubscribe send unsubscribe name-at-domian.com in the body to hangout-request-at-www2.mrbrklyn.com
I'm flattered you thought highly enough of me to name a mentality after
Thanks for finally outlining the true philosphy of the GPL. Even after
you said that people shouldnt be allowed into this country without
studying the Constition first. But you would much rather sweep those
inflammatory statements under the rug to make yourself feel better.
No I wouldnt hestitate to buy a Microsoft product if I knew it was
better. Much like you dont hesitate to buy clothes from third world
country's. Country's which dont treat their workers with respect. But
we wont worry about the little details we'll worry about what only
Either way you have sucessuflly perverted my message again.
----- Original Message -----
From: Adam Kosmin
Date: Saturday, January 17, 2004 5:02 am
Subject: [hangout] leeches=$(diff Free_Software Open_Source)
> I am starting to notice a trend and I am not happy about it. For
> lack of
> a better name, I'll just have some fun and call it the "Steve Milo
> mentality". Rather than allowing ourselves to be disillusioned by the
> growing number of people who are incorporating the use of non
> proprietary software into their daily lives, we need to take an honest
> look at their motives and if necessary, be willing to admit that
> most of
> these people are nothing more than leeches who could care less
> about the
> most important aspect of the Free Software movement: Freedom.
> Let's refresh our memory as to what I mean when I refer to freedom:
> * The freedom to run the program, for any purpose (freedom 0).
> * The freedom to study how the program works, and adapt it to
> your needs (freedom 1). Access to the source code is a
> precondition for
> * The freedom to redistribute copies so you can help your
> neighbor (freedom 2).
> * The freedom to improve the program, and release your
> improvements to the public, so that the whole community benefits
> (freedom 3). Access to the source code is a precondition for this.
> Sadly, this "new blood" has been sold on the philosophy of the Open
> Source campaign which was created in order to sell the byproducts
> of the
> Free Software development model. As many of us already know, the Open
> Source movement goes out of its way to avoid educating its
> followers on
> the sociological benefits offered by Free Software, but instead, sells
> its audience on functionality, security, and lower costs. This
> "free as
> in beer" sales pitch is creating more and more people who claim to
> support our cause but who in fact, are really just interested in
> gettingsomething for nothing.
> I think Steve's earlier comment makes my point:
> "Actually, more functional is much more than good enough, if the
> bettermore secure product is available from Microsoft then by all
> means it
> should be used."
> Anyone sharing such a ridiculous point of view obviously does not
> understand the underlying motives that went behind the creation of the
> GPL and yet, we have more and more of these people calling themselves
> "supporters" every day. If I were to apply this to a war, I'd say this
> is like having an army of 10,000 soldiers armed with rubber bands up
> against an army of 100 armed with machine guns and grenades.
> Since these people obviously don't understand the GPL or the Free
> Software movement which created it, how can we expect them to
> defend it?
> Simple answer: They won't and we would be fools to think otherwise.
> People like this are too focused on satisfying their own selfish
> interests. Here's another great comment by Steve which illustrates my
> "Microsoft broke federal laws, they arent bound by the GPL in any form
> or fashion. MS also has questionable business practices. If they were
> to make a better product than GNU/Linux then I would go out and buy
> So there you have it. These people wouldn't hesitate to finance a
> company who's business model is built upon destroying everything that
> the GPL represents so long as their own self interests are met.
> Obviously, there is much work to do. I am grateful for NYLXS' position
> as a supporter of Free Software and am looking forward to
> participatingso we can continue to educate the masses on the goals
> of the movement.
> Looking forward to the retreat...
> Adam Kosmin
> Ruben Safir (ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com) wrote:
> " FOOOOD FIGHT
> " this list has been dull ever since Marco resigned.
> " Ruben
> " On Fri, Jan 16, 2004 at 03:29:50PM +0000, psiegel-at-copper.net wrote:
> " >
> " > Gentlemen,
> " >
> " > Enough already. Disagreement is fine. Name calling is not, and,
> " > certainly, threats have no place here.
> " >
> " > If you cannot behave responsibly, please take your argument
> off this
> " > list.
> " >
> " > Peter
> " >
> " > Peter Siegel
> " >
> " >
> " > ____________________________
> " > NYLXS: New Yorker Free Software Users Scene
> " > Fair Use -
> " > because it's either fair use or useless....
> " > NYLXS is a trademark of NYLXS, Inc
> " --
> " __________________________
> " Brooklyn Linux Solutions
> " __________________________
> " DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS http://fairuse.nylxs.com
> " http://www.mrbrklyn.com - Consulting
> " http://www.inns.net <-- Happy Clients
> " http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
> " http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive or
> stories and articles from around the net
> " http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/downtown.html - See the New Downtown
> " 1-718-382-0585
> " ____________________________
> " NYLXS: New Yorker Free Software Users Scene
> " Fair Use -
> " because it's either fair use or useless....
> " NYLXS is a trademark of NYLXS, Inc
> "Yes, Your Honor. Now, where we are so far, in at least my
> line of reasoning, is I want to walk the Court through enough of our
> complaint to help the Court understand that IBM clearly did
> contribute a
> lot of the Unix-related information into Linux. We just don't know
> whatit is."
> -- Kevin McBride SCO vs. IBM 12/05/03
> NYLXS: New Yorker Free Software Users Scene
> Fair Use -
> because it's either fair use or useless....
> NYLXS is a trademark of NYLXS, Inc
NYLXS: New Yorker Free Software Users Scene
Fair Use -
because it's either fair use or useless....
NYLXS is a trademark of NYLXS, Inc