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DATE 2005-05-01

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MESSAGE
DATE 2005-05-23
FROM From: "Inker, Evan"
SUBJECT Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Student Interest in Computer Science Plummets
Student Interest in Computer Science Plummets
Technology companies struggle to fill vacant positions
http://chronicle.com/free/v51/i38/38a03101.htm
By ANDREA L. FOSTER

Students once saw computer-science classes as their ticket to wealth. Now,
as more technology jobs are outsourced to other countries, such classes are
seen as a path to unemployment.

New data show students' interest in the discipline is in a free fall. The
number of newly declared computer-science majors declined 32 percent from
the fall of 2000 to the fall of 2004, according to a report released this
month by the Computing Research Association, which represents computer
scientists in industry and academe. Another survey, from the Higher
Education Research Institute at the University of California at Los Angeles,
shows that the number of incoming freshmen who expressed an interest in
majoring in computer science has plummeted by 59 percent in the last four
years.

Students' waning enthusiasm for the field worries technology companies that
must work harder to fill vacant positions, as well as researchers who need a
steady supply of intellectual talent to fuel scientific breakthroughs.
Computer scientists are already struggling to maintain basic research
despite sharply reduced financial support from government agencies.

Computer scientists say their ranks need to grow for them to tackle such
challenges as protecting the country's financial, utility,
telecommunications, transportation, and defense systems from terrorist
attacks.

In response, the National Science Foundation and some colleges are stepping
up efforts to promote computer science -- especially to women and some
minority groups, whose representation in the field is minuscule.

"We may have to do a little bit of recruiting," says Stuart H. Zweben,
author of the Computing Research Association report and a professor and
chairman of the computer-science and engineering department at Ohio State
University at Columbus, where the number of computer-science majors dropped
28 percent from the fall of 2001 to the fall of 2004.

Why the Drain?

Computer scientists and undergraduates blame the field's anemia mostly on
news-media reports of technology jobs moving to developing countries, and on
the bursting of the dot-com bubble. At the height of the Internet boom, in
2000, it was not uncommon to see computer-science classrooms filled to
capacity. That fall the number of newly declared computer-science and
computer-engineering majors reached a high of 23,416, compared with 15,950
in 2004, according to the Computing Research Association.

Some computer-science professors say that much of the news coverage is
exaggerated, and that jobs in information technology remain plentiful. They
point to a Commerce Department study that projects that 70.2 percent of all
vacant positions in science and engineering between 2002 and 2012, or 1.6
million jobs, will be in information technology.

Edward D. Lazowska, a computer-science professor at the University of
Washington, says computer-science graduates from his university are
receiving multiple job offers. And Richard F. Rashid, senior vice president
for Microsoft Research, says Microsoft has more jobs for computer-science
graduates with bachelor's degrees than it can fill. The positions include
developers and program managers. "If you can't fill positions in the United
States, then you do need to look outside," says Mr. Rashid.

But while high-end technology jobs in the United States may be abundant, the
outsourcing of "low-end, routinized" information-technology jobs, including
some low-level programming positions, is on the rise, according to John F.
Sargent, a senior policy analyst at the Commerce Department's technology
administration.

He says the encouraging job figures that some scholars cite may be too
sanguine. The Commerce Department data was released in March 2004 but
collected in 2002 as companies were just starting to farm out much of their
information-technology work overseas. What's more, the department's
projected number of newly created information-technology jobs for the period
from 2002 and 2012, 1.15-million, is about a million fewer than the
department had projected three years earlier for roughly the same period.

Students seem to be playing it safe.

"People are loath to do computer science because they think, Well, gosh, my
job will just get outsourced," says Kevin W. Decker, president of the
computer-science club at Indiana University-Purdue University at
Indianapolis. Mr. Decker is a junior majoring in computer science. The
number of students pursuing bachelor's degrees in computer science at the
university has dropped to 146, from 161 a year ago.

Mr. Decker says he is not discouraged because he believes there always will
be work available for technology innovators. Mr. Decker speaks glowingly of
his job last summer at Apple Computer, where he helped the developers of
Safari, a Web browser. "I realized that after I got out of school I wanted
to ... lead a team of brilliant engineers, doing things that change the
world."

More Glamorous Fields

In some cases, computer-savvy students are turning to more glamorous fields
like bioinformatics and molecular biology, in which investigators are
mapping the human genome and doing stem-cell research, says Min C. Zhang, a
senior computer-science major at Dartmouth College. She says there were a
lot more computer-science majors in the class of 2003 than in her own class,
and among her friends in lower classes, some taking computer-science classes
have decided to major in biochemistry, she says.

Still others say the image of computer scientists as antisocial nerds turns
off many students.

"If you ask a kid to draw a caricature of what a computer scientist does,"
says Mr. Lazowska, "it's some overweight, greasy male, hunched down in front
of a terminal, in front of a workstation, in a little cubbyhole."

Professors say the creation in the last five years of new degrees in
information technology or information systems may also be offering
more-attractive alternatives to computer science. Computer science focuses
on how networks are engineered -- the theoretical aspects of computing --
and on writing software, while information technology focuses on applied
work, such as building Web sites, adapting systems to a business's needs,
and maintaining networks.

George Mason University started an information-technology program in the
fall of 2002, and this year has 726 students in the program. The number
keeps growing each year, with students particularly interested in
computer-security courses, says Anne Marchant, an information-technology
instructor at the university. Only 550 George Mason students are
computer-science majors. A few years ago the department had about 800
students who majored in the field.

Ms. Marchant blames the shift partly on what she sees as students'
deteriorating mathematics aptitude.

"Information technology is the right home for an awful lot of students who
do not have the math skills and do not really have the interest in becoming
programmers," she says.

Jesse J. Rangel, a senior at California State University at Bakersfield who
is a computer-science major, says some of his classmates avoid computer
science because it involves advanced mathematics and physics. "The sad fact
is that many students are not up for the challenge," he says.

Sounding the Alarm

Microsoft's Mr. Rashid, a former computer-science professor at Carnegie
Mellon University, and Bill Gates, the company's chairman and founder, were
in Washington last month to sound the alarm to lawmakers and journalists
about declining student interest in science and engineering in general and
computer science in particular.

"It's a major concern for us because we're a company that runs on people,"
says Mr. Rashid. "Our hiring has continued to go up, but unfortunately what
we're seeing right now is a decline in the potential supply."

The Information Technology Association of America, which promotes the
industry, this month started a program to prod colleges into better
preparing students for industry jobs.

Marjorie C. Bynum, a vice president of the association, says member
companies are having trouble filling positions not only because fewer
students are going into computer science, but also because many graduates
lack "soft skills."

"Many information-technology companies put a huge emphasis on skills like
project management, interpersonal communication, and just overall business
acumen," says Ms. Bynum. "Colleges and universities need to put more
emphasis around that."

Others are working to close a widening gender gap in the field.

Women's interest in computer science fell 80 percent between 1998 and 2004,
and only 0.3 percent of incoming freshmen women in 2004 expressed an
interest in majoring in computer science, according to the Higher Education
Research Institute.

"Some of us are making a more concerted effort to attract a diverse set of
people to our programs ... paying particular attention to women and students
from other underrepresented groups," such as African-Americans and
Hispanics, says Mr. Zweben.

Last month, for example, an Ohio State computer-science instructor organized
a regional conference on women and computing that attracted 100 female
computer scientists in academe and industry.

Students from 13 colleges in Michigan and Ohio made contact with each other
and with women who hold management positions in technology companies.

This spring the National Science Foundation started a program called
Broadening Participation in Computing to increase the number and diversity
of students receiving computer-science degrees. The foundation plans to
award $14-million in the 2006 fiscal year to colleges or to partnerships of
colleges and other institutions that are trying to recruit women, minority
students, and people with disabilities into computer science.

Janice E. Cuny, a computer-science professor at the University of Oregon who
runs the NSF program, says that to deal with the shortage of women in
computer science, colleges should recognize that women take a more practical
approach to the field than men do.

"Women seem to come to computer science later," says Ms. Cuny, citing
research by Jane Margolis, of the University of California at Los Angeles
Graduate School of Education, and Allan Fisher, a former associate dean of
computer science at Carnegie Mellon University. "Women seem to be more
interested in the uses of computer science, whereas guys seem to be more
interested in the technology itself."

For that reason, Ms. Cuny and other professors advocate that colleges
restructure their curricula. Too many teenagers naïvely assume that the
field is just about programming, they say, a perception reinforced by the
Advanced Placement examination in computer science.

As an example of a course that presents a broader view of the field, Ms.
Cuny cites an introductory computer-science class at the Georgia Institute
of Technology, taught by Mark Guzdial, in which students dissect a
computer-animated scene of wildebeests charging over a ridge in the Disney
film The Lion King.

Some professors stress that high-school students need to be exposed to the
imaginative aspects of computer science. Mr. Lazowska, of the University of
Washington, recommends that more high schools hold competitions for students
to design and build robots. "It's gender neutral, it's creative, and
discovery oriented," he says.

Adds Mr. Rashid, of Microsoft: "You need to talk about the romance of the
field. It's not all about people sitting in cubicles eating pizza and typing
away endless hours on a keyboard."

THE RISE AND FALL OF COMPUTER SCIENCE

While student interest rose to record highs during the dot-com boom, in
recent years the percentage of freshmen at four-year colleges expecting to
major in computer science has fallen sharply.

All Freshmen Men Women
1990 1.7% 2.3% 1.1%
1991 1.8% 2.5% 1.2%
1992 1.6% 2.4% 0.9%
1993 1.6% 2.6% 0.9%
1994 1.9% 3.1% 0.9%
1995 2.2% 3.7% 1.0%
1996 2.7% 4.6% 1.2%
1997 3.0% 5.1% 1.3%
1998 3.4% 5.8% 1.5%
1999 3.7% 6.6% 1.4%
2000 3.7% 6.5% 1.4%
2001 3.3% 6.1% 1.2%
2002 2,2% 4.2% 0.7%
2003 1.7% 3.3% 0.4%
2004 1.4% 2.8% 0.3%
SOURCE: U. of California at Los Angeles Higher Education Research Institute


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  1. 2005-05-01 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: [wwwac] Monday 2 May 2005 NYC Committee on Technology in Government: Telecommunications Infrastructure and Economic Development
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  4. 2005-05-01 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Linus announced new tool for version control
  5. 2005-05-01 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: [wwwac] Monday 2 May 2005 NYC Committee on Technology in Government: Telecommunications Infrastructure and Economic Development
  6. 2005-05-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] DMCA Boarder War
  7. 2005-05-02 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Microsoft Reaches Out to Open-Source Community
  8. 2005-05-02 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Microsoft Reaches Out to Open-Source Community
  9. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] ssl for pop3
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  15. 2005-05-04 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] FW: LinuxWorld Summit NYC: Explore the possibilities. Register to
  16. 2005-05-04 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: Personal Liberties in the Age of Terrorism, May 13 - Free for BC Students!
  17. 2005-05-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Last Months Board Meeting Minutes
  18. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Last Months Board Meeting Minutes
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  20. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Real Time Blackhole sites
  21. 2005-05-03 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Real Time Blackhole sites
  22. 2005-05-03 Matthew <mph-at-dorsai.org> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Real Time Blackhole sites
  23. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Real Time Blackhole sites
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  27. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] City Is Backing Makeover for Decaying
  28. 2005-05-03 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] City Is Backing Makeover for Decaying Brooklyn
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  30. 2005-05-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] More on the Free Linux Distro
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  32. 2005-05-04 dspira-at-att.net (Dave_att) Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] FW: LinuxWorld Summit NYC: Explore the possibilities. Register to day.
  33. 2005-05-04 swd <sderrick-at-optonline.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Old Hood is going digital subway
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  35. 2005-05-05 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Ruth email me please
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  54. 2005-05-11 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B
  55. 2005-05-11 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B Vi sa
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  57. 2005-05-11 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B Visa Program
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  61. 2005-05-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B Visa Program
  62. 2005-05-12 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Novell loses another executive
  63. 2005-05-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B Visa Program
  64. 2005-05-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] I leave this for your discussion ..
  65. 2005-05-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Novell loses another executive
  66. 2005-05-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Opposing Views: The Debate Over The H-1B
  67. 2005-05-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [hangout] Arafat Dead - and the beat goes on..
  68. 2005-05-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[NYLXS_-_HANGOUT]_Opposing_Views:_The_Debate?=
  69. 2005-05-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Moving off of SuSE
  70. 2005-05-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Null modem
  71. 2005-05-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Null modem
  72. 2005-05-12 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Null modem
  73. 2005-05-12 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Null modem
  74. 2005-05-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Moving off of SuSE
  75. 2005-05-12 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Moving off of SuSE
  76. 2005-05-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Null modem
  77. 2005-05-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Moving off of SuSE
  78. 2005-05-12 From: "Jared Martin" <jmartin-at-dglaw.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Moving off of SuSE
  79. 2005-05-12 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Moving off of SuSE
  80. 2005-05-12 Mark Andrews <Mark_Andrews-at-isc.org> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] I have been patient.
  81. 2005-05-13 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] IBM backs Firefox in-houseBy Martin LaMonica, CNET News.com
  82. 2005-05-13 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] IBM backs Firefox in-houseBy Martin LaMonica, CNET News.com
  83. 2005-05-13 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] bruce.lai-at-council.nyc.ny.us: Upcoming hearings by the Committee on Technology in Government of the New York City Council (as of 5.13.05).
  84. 2005-05-13 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Board Meeting Reminder
  85. 2005-05-13 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Taking a look back prior to 9-11
  86. 2005-05-14 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Real Time Blackhole sites
  87. 2005-05-14 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Hope this still works
  88. 2005-05-14 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Open Meeting: Freedom-IT Scholarship fund
  89. 2005-05-15 swd <sderrick-at-optonline.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Business
  90. 2005-05-15 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Membership and Fund Raising/ Bryant Park
  91. 2005-05-15 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Business
  92. 2005-05-15 swd <sderrick-at-optonline.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Business
  93. 2005-05-15 swd <sderrick-at-optonline.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] RE: Business - NOT SPAM!
  94. 2005-05-15 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Membership and Fund Raising/ Bryant Park
  95. 2005-05-15 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] RE: Business - NOT SPAM!
  96. 2005-05-16 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Membership and Fund Raising/ Bryant Park
  97. 2005-05-16 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Hyper-Threading Vulnerability
  98. 2005-05-16 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nylxs website
  99. 2005-05-16 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [info] NYLXS]
  100. 2005-05-16 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] RE: [hangout] Ruben, "Star Wars" tickets are on sale now on
  101. 2005-05-16 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] RE: [hangout] Ruben, "Star Wars" tickets are
  102. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Healthcare Information Technology
  103. 2005-05-17 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Star Wars
  104. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Star Wars
  105. 2005-05-17 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Star Wars
  106. 2005-05-16 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] RE: [hangout] Ruben, "Star Wars" tickets are
  107. 2005-05-16 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [info] NYLXS]
  108. 2005-05-17 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Web sites: Linux Distribution Chooser
  109. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] the internet has become useless
  110. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  111. 2005-05-17 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  112. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  113. 2005-05-17 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  114. 2005-05-17 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  115. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  116. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  117. 2005-05-17 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  118. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  119. 2005-05-17 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  120. 2005-05-17 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  121. 2005-05-17 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] SUSE 9.3 Disks
  122. 2005-05-17 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  123. 2005-05-17 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  124. 2005-05-17 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: Don't forget to take advantage of Novell's great offer on shopNovell
  125. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: Healthcare Information Technology
  126. 2005-05-17 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  127. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  128. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] FREEDOM-IT MEETING - Tomorrow
  129. 2005-05-17 From: "J.E. Cripps" <cycmn-at-nyct.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  130. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Back to school
  131. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Brooklyn Centric News
  132. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] And while we are talking about Brooklyn College...
  133. 2005-05-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Free Pass to computer expo
  134. 2005-05-18 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Board Minutes May 11 2005
  135. 2005-05-18 Mark Simko <msimko-at-optonline.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Board Minutes May 11 2005
  136. 2005-05-18 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Board Minutes May 11 2005
  137. 2005-05-18 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Board Minutes May 11 2005
  138. 2005-05-18 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: Healthcare Information Technology
  139. 2005-05-18 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] Dvorak's article on Linux Community
  140. 2005-05-19 Ruben Safir <mrbrklyn101-at-yahoo.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] fsfsffsfsd
  141. 2005-05-19 Ruben Safir <mrbrklyn101-at-yahoo.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] fsfsdfasdfsd
  142. 2005-05-19 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: [Politics] Lost
  143. 2005-05-19 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Sendmail Relaying
  144. 2005-05-20 dspira-at-att.net (Dave_att) Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: FW: Returned mail: delivery problems encountered
  145. 2005-05-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Minutes of Grant proposal committee 5-17-05
  146. 2005-05-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Minutes of Grant proposal committee 5-17-05
  147. 2005-05-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Freedom-IT Report
  148. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Freedom-IT Report
  149. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Flu preparations
  150. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Transistor Engineering
  151. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Anyone ever hear of this company?
  152. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <mrbrklyn101-at-yahoo.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Star Wars Party
  153. 2005-05-23 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Student Interest in Computer Science Plummets
  154. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Student Interest in Computer Science Plummets
  155. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Student Interest in Computer Science Plummets
  156. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Student Interest in Computer Science Plummets
  157. 2005-05-23 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Token Booths Shut Down At Eight Stations In Manhattan, Brooklyn
  158. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <mrbrklyn101-at-yahoo.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] su security
  159. 2005-05-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: refreshing
  160. 2005-05-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Real Time Blackhole sites
  161. 2005-05-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: In case you could use someone
  162. 2005-05-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Anyone know who IBM is using to teach teachers about GNU Systems?
  163. 2005-05-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] For Billy
  164. 2005-05-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Star Wars Night Tomorrow
  165. 2005-05-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Google Job in NY
  166. 2005-05-25 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Suse and floppy disks
  167. 2005-05-25 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: Re: [wwwac] Court rules that presence of encryption software may be viewed as evidence of criminal intent.
  168. 2005-05-25 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Netscape 8.0 Requires Internet Explorer
  169. 2005-05-25 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Suse and floppy disks
  170. 2005-05-25 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Suse and floppy disks
  171. 2005-05-25 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Netscape 8.0 Requires Internet Explorer
  172. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: SpiderTools Linux Training Savings
  173. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fw: [Politics] Monsanto's confidential research finds that GM foods mess up rats
  174. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  175. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Fw: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  176. 2005-05-26 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  177. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: Fw: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  178. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: Fw: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  179. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Star Wars triggers P2P network crackdown
  180. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  181. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Star Wars triggers P2P network crackdown
  182. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  183. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  184. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  185. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  186. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Treo 650
  187. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Copyright Myth and the BSA
  188. 2005-05-26 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  189. 2005-05-26 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Treo 650
  190. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  191. 2005-05-26 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  192. 2005-05-26 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  193. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  194. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  195. 2005-05-26 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  196. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  197. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  198. 2005-05-26 From: "Jared T. Martin" <jmartin-at-dglaw.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] How do I edit my subscription?
  199. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  200. 2005-05-26 From: "Michael L. Richardson" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Treo 650
  201. 2005-05-26 Michael E George <meg7-at-nyu.edu> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Logo and motto
  202. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Logo and motto
  203. 2005-05-26 dspira-at-att.net (Dave_att) Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS mission statement
  204. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS mission statement
  205. 2005-05-26 dspira-at-att.net (Dave_att) Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Donation page on website.
  206. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Logo and motto
  207. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Donation page on website.
  208. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Prganizational Structure -
  209. 2005-05-26 dspira-at-att.net (Dave_att) Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Donation page on website.
  210. 2005-05-26 dspira-at-att.net (Dave_att) Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Logo and motto
  211. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Logo and motto
  212. 2005-05-26 From: "Derrick H. Lewis" <lewisdj-at-bc.edu> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Website
  213. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Website
  214. 2005-05-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] I think this was the constitution minus a slight change we had to
  215. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: In case you could use someone
  216. 2005-05-27 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  217. 2005-05-27 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  218. 2005-05-27 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  219. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [CFSG-forum] Fwd: [refurbishers] New York City Electronics
  220. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [CFSG-forum] Fwd: [refurbishers] New York City Electronics
  221. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [CFSG-forum] Fwd: [refurbishers] New York City Electronics
  222. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Fwd: Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [CFSG-forum] Fwd: [refurbishers]
  223. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [CFSG-forum] Fwd: [refurbishers] New
  224. 2005-05-27 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] =?utf-8?Q?Re:_[NYLXS_-_HANGOUT]_Re:_[CFSG-forum]_Fwd:_[ref?=
  225. 2005-05-27 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] I want a big 1973 Buick LeSabre
  226. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [CFSG-forum] Fwd:
  227. 2005-05-27 Michael E George <meg7-at-nyu.edu> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT]Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [CFSG-forum]
  228. 2005-05-27 From: "rc" <ray-pub-at-rcn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  229. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  230. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  231. 2005-05-27 From: "rc" <ray-pub-at-rcn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  232. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  233. 2005-05-27 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  234. 2005-05-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  235. 2005-05-28 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  236. 2005-05-28 From: "rc" <ray-pub-at-rcn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  237. 2005-05-28 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: [Hardhats-members] Re: Welcome!] Healthcare software under
  238. 2005-05-28 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  239. 2005-05-28 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Lccal News in Brooklyn
  240. 2005-05-28 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Sunday Server Maintence Agenda
  241. 2005-05-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Jobs
  242. 2005-05-29 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Sunday Server Maintence Agenda
  243. 2005-05-29 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> RE: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia's tablet
  244. 2005-05-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Sunday Server Maintence Agenda
  245. 2005-05-29 David Etengoff <edtechmdy-at-yahoo.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] please remove my E-mail
  246. 2005-05-29 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Sunday Server Maintence Agenda
  247. 2005-05-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Sunday Server Maintence Agenda
  248. 2005-05-29 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Sunday Server Maintence Agenda
  249. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Web Server Status
  250. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Updates and Discussion
  251. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem
  252. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] == CPRS Demo ==]
  253. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  254. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  255. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  256. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  257. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  258. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  259. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  260. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  261. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  262. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  263. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: [Hardhats-members] Re: CPRS Connection Problem]
  264. 2005-05-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] RMS on software patents
  265. 2005-05-31 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Novell acquires Immunix to enhance SuSe Linux security
  266. 2005-05-31 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Nokia allows Linux Kernel to use their patents

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