MESSAGE
| DATE | 2008-03-21 |
| FROM | Ruben Safir
|
| SUBJECT | Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] Benefits/drawbacks of building Linux as a package [was: Looking for recommendations on Linux Distro]
|
On Tue, Mar 18, 2008 at 10:34:42AM -0400, Paul Robert Marino wrote:
> I was very disapointed by the fact that by the time I had a spare
> machine to install it on the gnu gentoo hurd install isos were taken off
> of their ftp server due to the fact that it wasn't acepted as an offical
> version of gnu gentoo.
Well, isn't there unofficial versions floating around?
> The only other hurd distro I've found is gnu
> debian hurd and my experiances with debian prevents me from trying it.
Hmmm. What official distro's are on the hurd site?
Ruben
> On Sun, 16 Mar 2008 2:43 am, Ruben Safir wrote:
> >also for what it is worth, I'm looking forward to the day that this
> >can work on my standard PC. I hope I'm not dead before this can get my
> >sound card running.
> >
> >http://www.gnu.org/software/hurd/hurd.html
> >
> >Introduction to the Hurd
> >
> >The GNU Hurd is the GNU project's replacement for the Unix kernel. The
> >Hurd is a collection of servers that run on the Mach microkernel to
> >implement file systems, network protocols, file access control, and
> >other features that are implemented by the Unix kernel or similar
> >kernels
> >(such as Linux).
> >
> >Currently, the Hurd runs on IA32 machines. The Hurd should, and
> >probably
> >will, be ported to other hardware architectures or other microkernels
> >in the future. Advantages of the Hurd The Hurd is not the most
> >advanced
> >kernel known to the planet (yet), but it does have a number of enticing
> >features:
> >
> >it's free software
> > Anybody can use, modify, and redistribute it under the terms of the
> > GNU General Public License (GPL).
> >it's compatible
> > The Hurd provides a familiar programming and user environment. For
> >all
> > intents and purposes, the Hurd is a modern Unix-like kernel. The
> >Hurd
> > uses the GNU C Library, whose development closely tracks standards
> > such as ANSI/ISO, BSD, POSIX, Single Unix, SVID, and X/Open.
> >it's built to survive
> > Unlike other popular kernel software, the Hurd has an
> >object-oriented
> > structure that allows it to evolve without compromising its
> > design. This structure will help the Hurd undergo major redesign
> > and modifications without having to be entirely rewritten.
> >it's scalable
> > The Hurd implementation is aggressively multithreaded so that
> > it runs efficiently on both single processors and symmetric
> > multiprocessors. The Hurd interfaces are designed to allow
> >transparent
> > network clusters (collectives), although this feature has not yet
> > been implemented.
> >it's extensible
> > The Hurd is an attractive platform for learning how to become a
> >kernel
> > hacker or for implementing new ideas in kernel technology. Every
> > part of the system is designed to be modified and extended.
> >it's stable
> > It is possible to develop and test new Hurd kernel components
> >without
> > rebooting the machine (not even accidentally). Running your own
> >kernel
> > components doesn't interfere with other users, and so no special
> > system privileges are required. The mechanism for kernel extensions
> >is
> > secure by design: it is impossible to impose your changes upon
> >other
> > users unless they authorize them or you are the system
> >administrator.
> >it exists
> > The Hurd is real software that works Right Now. It is not a
> >research
> > project or a proposal. You don't have to wait at all before you can
> > start using and developing it.
> >
> >What the Hurd means According to Thomas Bushnell, BSG, the primary
> >architect of the Hurd:
> >
> > `Hurd' stands for `Hird of Unix-Replacing Daemons'. And, then,
> > `Hird' stands for `Hurd of Interfaces Representing Depth'. We have
> > here, to my knowledge, the first software to be named by a pair of
> > mutually recursive acronyms.
> >
> >Status of the project
> >
> >The Hurd, together with the GNU Mach microkernel, the GNU C Library and
> >the other GNU and non-GNU programs in the GNU system, provide a rather
> >complete and usable operating system today. It is not ready for
> >production
> >use, as there are still many bugs and missing features. However, it
> >should
> >be a good base for further development and non-critical application
> >usage.
> >
> >The GNU system (also called GNU/Hurd) is completely self-contained
> >(you can compile all parts of it using GNU itself). You can run several
> >instances of the Hurd in parallel, and debug even critical servers in
> >one Hurd instance with gdb running on another Hurd instance. You can
> >run the X window system, applications that use it, and advanced server
> >applications like the Apache webserver.
> >
> >On the negative side, the support for character devices (like sound
> >cards)
> >and other hardware is mostly missing. Although the POSIX interface
> >is provided, some additional interfaces like POSIX shared memory or
> >semaphores are still under development.
> >
> >All this applies to the current development version, and not to the
> >last
> >release (0.2). We encourage everybody who is interested to try out the
> >latest development version, and send feedback to the Hurd developers.
> >
> >On Sun, Mar 16, 2008 at 02:35:03AM -0400, Ruben Safir wrote: > On Sat,
> >Mar 15, 2008 at 08:48:34PM -0400, Ron Guerin wrote: > > Ruben Safir
> >wrote:
> >> > > > > Package managers by and large, actually all of them, suck in
> >the first place > > > Your checklist is wishful thinking. And I'm not
> >talking out of my hat. I'm > > > talking from a SUSE 5.3 distro
> >running
> >on a P2 right now which has been continually patched > > > by hand for
> >a LOT of years now. > > > > If by suck, you mean works extremely well
> >and makes millions of people > > happy, then yeah, most of them suck.
> >Our package managers suck. I wish > > everything sucked as much as my
> >package manager does. > > > > > The single biggest mistake someone can
> >make aside from a dread aweful > > > rm command in jest is to install
> >the
> >Kernel from anything but an authenticed > > > source from
> >kernel.org. >
> >> > > This advice runs counter to that of kernel maintainers, especially
> >one > > fellow named Linus Torvalds, who said quite some years ago that
> >the > > kernel.org kernel would henceforth not be a finished and ready
> >to use > > kernel, IHHO. The quote was something along the lines of
> >"that's the > > job of the packagers" > > > > > Also - for what it is
> >worth > > >From the Kernel README file: > > INSTALLING the kernel: >
> >> - If you install the full sources, put the kernel tarball in a >
> >directory where you have permissions (eg. your home directory) and >
> >unpack it: > > gzip -cd linux-2.6.XX.tar.gz | tar xvf -
> >> > Replace "XX" with the version number of the latest kernel. >
> >> Do NOT use the /usr/src/linux area! This area has a (usually >
> >incomplete) set of kernel headers that are used by the library header
> >> files. They should match the library, and not get messed up by >
> >whatever the kernel-du-jour happens to be. > > - You can also upgrade
> >between 2.6.xx releases by patching. Patches are > distributed in
> >the
> >traditional gzip and the new bzip2 format. To > install by
> >patching,
> >get all the newer patch files, enter the > top level directory of
> >the kernel source (linux-2.6.xx) and execute: > > gzip
> >-cd ../patch-2.6.xx.gz | patch -p1 > > > etc etc > > > "Yeah - I write
> >Free Software...so SUE ME" > © Copyright for the Digital Millennium
> >
> >-- http://www.mrbrklyn.com - Interesting Stuff http://www.nylxs.com -
> >Leadership Development in Free Software
> >
> >So many immigrant groups have swept through our town that Brooklyn,
> >like
> >Atlantis, reaches mythological proportions in the mind of the world -
> >RI Safir 1998
> >
> >http://fairuse.nylxs.com DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS -
> >RI Safir 2002
> >
> >"Yeah - I write Free Software...so SUE ME"
> >
> >"The tremendous problem we face is that we are becoming sharecroppers
> >to our own cultural heritage -- we need the ability to participate in
> >our own society."
> >
> >"> I'm an engineer. I choose the best tool for the job, politics be
> >damned.< You must be a stupid engineer then, because politcs and
> >technology have been attached at the hip since the 1st dynasty in
> >Ancient Egypt. I guess you missed that one."
> >
> >© Copyright for the Digital Millennium
> ___________________________________________
> The average person does a lot of work in the name of laziness!
> Save youre self the effort by doing it right the first time.
> Do it with free speech software.
--
http://www.mrbrklyn.com - Interesting Stuff
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://fairuse.nylxs.com DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
"Yeah - I write Free Software...so SUE ME"
"The tremendous problem we face is that we are becoming sharecroppers to our own cultural heritage -- we need the ability to participate in our own society."
"> I'm an engineer. I choose the best tool for the job, politics be damned.<
You must be a stupid engineer then, because politcs and technology have been attached at the hip since the 1st dynasty in Ancient Egypt. I guess you missed that one."
© Copyright for the Digital Millennium
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