|FROM ||Ruben Safir
|SUBJECT ||Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [nylug-talk] Tuesday 6 December 2011 NYLUG: General Meeting
|From owner-hangout-outgoing-at-mrbrklyn.com Mon Dec 5 21:15:31 2011
Received: by www2.mrbrklyn.com (Postfix)
id 682479E895; Mon, 5 Dec 2011 21:15:31 -0500 (EST)
Received: by www2.mrbrklyn.com (Postfix, from userid 28)
id 571C7100B42; Mon, 5 Dec 2011 21:15:31 -0500 (EST)
Received: from mailbackend.panix.com (mailbackend.panix.com [126.96.36.199])
by www2.mrbrklyn.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 95AA49E895
for ; Mon, 5 Dec 2011 21:15:30 -0500 (EST)
Received: from panix2.panix.com (panix2.panix.com [188.8.131.52])
by mailbackend.panix.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 021D12893E
for ; Mon, 5 Dec 2011 21:16:28 -0500 (EST)
Received: by panix2.panix.com (Postfix, from userid 20529)
id EB6E033C7E; Mon, 5 Dec 2011 21:16:27 -0500 (EST)
Date: Mon, 5 Dec 2011 21:15:35 -0500
From: Ruben Safir
Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [nylug-talk] Tuesday 6 December 2011 NYLUG: General Meeting
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.20 (2009-06-14)
For anyone who is paying attention:
----- Forwarded message from Ruben Safir -----
> So you're saying an announcemnt about a NYLUG event shouldn't go to the NYLUG
> mailing list? ? I didn't see 15 mailing lists as recipients of that email, so
> if it went to different lists, they were sent separately.
That wasn't a NYLUG announcement. That was Jay sending his stuff
around, and speaking for NYLUG.
> > As it is, AS A FACT, those who are incorperating NYLUG have grave
> > reservations about how and when to widen NYLUGs membership
> > respresentation, and having 30 strangers show up at this meeting, all
> > members of "The Call" press room who have no interest in NYLUG, is not
> > going to be in anyway helpful.
> If a NYLUG member posting an invitation/reminder to an open NYLUG event is
> deemed as wrong, then there's something seriously wrong here.
That would be true, and you should read a history lesson.
> Someone else posting an invitation might be unusual, but what you've posted is
> derrogatory, discriminitory, and is not respectful of other people's opinions.
What I'm telling you, Chris, is FACTUAL. Jay has, as a fact, previously
tried to pack meetings with like minded outsiders and to turn
orgnaizations inside out, and even attempt to take them over.
Domains have been stolen, trademarks disputed over, and a ton of other
obnoxious troubles have been created. Lookup the history of Orgcom, for
> I'm now giving you a warning, because that's against the list rules.
> > And FWIW, as a fact, NYLUG is NOT a Democracy at the moment, something
> > which a good charter will hopefully change. And after that, it will not
> > be an Anarcist organziation either.
> > Whether the event is OPEN or not is not the issue. Of course it is
> > open. Whether 10 people speak for NYLUG and represent it, that is the
> > issue. And BTW - no one who has followed the history of NY free
> > software groups would have found any of this unpredictable.
> NYLUG is its members.
No - it is not. NYLUG is a pending corperation looking for 501C
tax status, and that is why there is going to be a meeting.
And BTW - that is why Ron is so upset, and why all these people who have
their hearts in the right places, are in dispute about what to do. I
hope you can make it on Tuesday evening. I think it is important for
you to be there.
> When someone comes to a NYLUG meeting, that's most of
> who they'll meet. Same for the mailing list. The NYLUG members represent
> NYLUG more than you might realize, regardless of whether that's "official" or
No Chris. That is not right. NYLUG has certain real assets, like the
NYLUG mailing list, the NYLUG hardware, the nylug domain name, which is
registered to Aaron Grogan, for some reason, and other real assets, not
the least of which is its reputation and name.
NYLUG being owned by its members, at THIS juncture, is a dream and has
been an illusion for years. It has been a benevolent dictatorship,
like the Linux Kernal itself, with legal ownership by Jim Gleason and
run over the last decade by Jim and Ari, and then Peter, and Ron and
then Ron and company, and then Ron and Brian, all still owned by Jim,
who has largely been inactive.
The FACT that NYLUG was incorperated is what has now changed. Now it
can continue being a form of benovolent dictatorship, in this case by
the offices who incorperated it, OR it can become a member drive
organization. That is what is on the table for discussion on Tuesday.
http://www.mrbrklyn.com - Interesting Stuff
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://fairuse.nylxs.com DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
"Yeah - I write Free Software...so SUE ME"
"The tremendous problem we face is that we are becoming sharecroppers to our own cultural heritage -- we need the ability to participate in our own society."
"> I'm an engineer. I choose the best tool for the job, politics be damned.<
You must be a stupid engineer then, because politcs and technology have been attached at the hip since the 1st dynasty in Ancient Egypt. I guess you missed that one."
? Copyright for the Digital Millennium