Tue Feb 17 08:09:20 2026
EVENTS
 FREE
SOFTWARE
INSTITUTE

POLITICS
JOBS
MEMBERS'
CORNER

MAILING
LIST

NYLXS Mailing Lists and Archives
NYLXS Members have a lot to say and share but we don't keep many secrets. Join the Hangout Mailing List and say your peice.

DATE 2025-12-01

HANGOUT

2026-02-17 | 2026-01-17 | 2025-12-17 | 2025-11-17 | 2025-10-17 | 2025-09-17 | 2025-08-17 | 2025-07-17 | 2025-06-17 | 2025-05-17 | 2025-04-17 | 2025-03-17 | 2025-02-17 | 2025-01-17 | 2024-12-17 | 2024-11-17 | 2024-10-17 | 2024-09-17 | 2024-08-17 | 2024-07-17 | 2024-06-17 | 2024-05-17 | 2024-04-17 | 2024-03-17 | 2024-02-17 | 2024-01-17 | 2023-12-17 | 2023-11-17 | 2023-10-17 | 2023-09-17 | 2023-08-17 | 2023-07-17 | 2023-06-17 | 2023-05-17 | 2023-04-17 | 2023-03-17 | 2023-02-17 | 2023-01-17 | 2022-12-17 | 2022-11-17 | 2022-10-17 | 2022-09-17 | 2022-08-17 | 2022-07-17 | 2022-06-17 | 2022-05-17 | 2022-04-17 | 2022-03-17 | 2022-02-17 | 2022-01-17 | 2021-12-17 | 2021-11-17 | 2021-10-17 | 2021-09-17 | 2021-08-17 | 2021-07-17 | 2021-06-17 | 2021-05-17 | 2021-04-17 | 2021-03-17 | 2021-02-17 | 2021-01-17 | 2020-12-17 | 2020-11-17 | 2020-10-17 | 2020-09-17 | 2020-08-17 | 2020-07-17 | 2020-06-17 | 2020-05-17 | 2020-04-17 | 2020-03-17 | 2020-02-17 | 2020-01-17 | 2019-12-17 | 2019-11-17 | 2019-10-17 | 2019-09-17 | 2019-08-17 | 2019-07-17 | 2019-06-17 | 2019-05-17 | 2019-04-17 | 2019-03-17 | 2019-02-17 | 2019-01-17 | 2018-12-17 | 2018-11-17 | 2018-10-17 | 2018-09-17 | 2018-08-17 | 2018-07-17 | 2018-06-17 | 2018-05-17 | 2018-04-17 | 2018-03-17 | 2018-02-17 | 2018-01-17 | 2017-12-17 | 2017-11-17 | 2017-10-17 | 2017-09-17 | 2017-08-17 | 2017-07-17 | 2017-06-17 | 2017-05-17 | 2017-04-17 | 2017-03-17 | 2017-02-17 | 2017-01-17 | 2016-12-17 | 2016-11-17 | 2016-10-17 | 2016-09-17 | 2016-08-17 | 2016-07-17 | 2016-06-17 | 2016-05-17 | 2016-04-17 | 2016-03-17 | 2016-02-17 | 2016-01-17 | 2015-12-17 | 2015-11-17 | 2015-10-17 | 2015-09-17 | 2015-08-17 | 2015-07-17 | 2015-06-17 | 2015-05-17 | 2015-04-17 | 2015-03-17 | 2015-02-17 | 2015-01-17 | 2014-12-17 | 2014-11-17 | 2014-10-17 | 2014-09-17 | 2014-08-17 | 2014-07-17 | 2014-06-17 | 2014-05-17 | 2014-04-17 | 2014-03-17 | 2014-02-17 | 2014-01-17 | 2013-12-17 | 2013-11-17 | 2013-10-17 | 2013-09-17 | 2013-08-17 | 2013-07-17 | 2013-06-17 | 2013-05-17 | 2013-04-17 | 2013-03-17 | 2013-02-17 | 2013-01-17 | 2012-12-17 | 2012-11-17 | 2012-10-17 | 2012-09-17 | 2012-08-17 | 2012-07-17 | 2012-06-17 | 2012-05-17 | 2012-04-17 | 2012-03-17 | 2012-02-17 | 2012-01-17 | 2011-12-17 | 2011-11-17 | 2011-10-17 | 2011-09-17 | 2011-08-17 | 2011-07-17 | 2011-06-17 | 2011-05-17 | 2011-04-17 | 2011-03-17 | 2011-02-17 | 2011-01-17 | 2010-12-17 | 2010-11-17 | 2010-10-17 | 2010-09-17 | 2010-08-17 | 2010-07-17 | 2010-06-17 | 2010-05-17 | 2010-04-17 | 2010-03-17 | 2010-02-17 | 2010-01-17 | 2009-12-17 | 2009-11-17 | 2009-10-17 | 2009-09-17 | 2009-08-17 | 2009-07-17 | 2009-06-17 | 2009-05-17 | 2009-04-17 | 2009-03-17 | 2009-02-17 | 2009-01-17 | 2008-12-17 | 2008-11-17 | 2008-10-17 | 2008-09-17 | 2008-08-17 | 2008-07-17 | 2008-06-17 | 2008-05-17 | 2008-04-17 | 2008-03-17 | 2008-02-17 | 2008-01-17 | 2007-12-17 | 2007-11-17 | 2007-10-17 | 2007-09-17 | 2007-08-17 | 2007-07-17 | 2007-06-17 | 2007-05-17 | 2007-04-17 | 2007-03-17 | 2007-02-17 | 2007-01-17 | 2006-12-17 | 2006-11-17 | 2006-10-17 | 2006-09-17 | 2006-08-17 | 2006-07-17 | 2006-06-17 | 2006-05-17 | 2006-04-17 | 2006-03-17 | 2006-02-17 | 2006-01-17 | 2005-12-17 | 2005-11-17 | 2005-10-17 | 2005-09-17 | 2005-08-17 | 2005-07-17 | 2005-06-17 | 2005-05-17 | 2005-04-17 | 2005-03-17 | 2005-02-17 | 2005-01-17 | 2004-12-17 | 2004-11-17 | 2004-10-17 | 2004-09-17 | 2004-08-17 | 2004-07-17 | 2004-06-17 | 2004-05-17 | 2004-04-17 | 2004-03-17 | 2004-02-17 | 2004-01-17 | 2003-12-17 | 2003-11-17 | 2003-10-17 | 2003-09-17 | 2003-08-17 | 2003-07-17 | 2003-06-17 | 2003-05-17 | 2003-04-17 | 2003-03-17 | 2003-02-17 | 2003-01-17 | 2002-12-17 | 2002-11-17 | 2002-10-17 | 2002-09-17 | 2002-08-17 | 2002-07-17 | 2002-06-17 | 2002-05-17 | 2002-04-17 | 2002-03-17 | 2002-02-17 | 2002-01-17 | 2001-12-17 | 2001-11-17 | 2001-10-17 | 2001-09-17 | 2001-08-17 | 2001-07-17 | 2001-06-17 | 2001-05-17 | 2001-04-17 | 2001-03-17 | 2001-02-17 | 2001-01-17 | 2000-12-17 | 2000-11-17 | 2000-10-17 | 2000-09-17 | 2000-08-17 | 2000-07-17 | 2000-06-17 | 2000-05-17 | 2000-04-17 | 2000-03-17 | 2000-02-17 | 2000-01-17 | 1999-12-17

Key: Value:

Key: Value:

MESSAGE
DATE 2025-12-05
FROM Ruben Safir
SUBJECT Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Self Driving Cars are coming soon..

The Wall Street Journal
1M Followers
Waymo’s Self-Driving Cars Are Suddenly Behaving Like New York Cabbies
Story by Katherine Bindley
• 2d • 4 min read
In this article
UBER TECHNOLOGIES, INC. UBER ▲ ‎+0.33%‎
Waymos were long known for their achingly cautious behavior. © Jeff Chiu/AP

SAN FRANCISCO, Calif.—It was like a scene out of a movie: a pair of
white Jaguars zipping through a two-lane tunnel, changing lanes at the
same time in a zigzag formation. But this one had a twist. They were
both Waymos, the self-driving vehicles known for their achingly cautious
behavior.
The Most Realistic Game Of The Year
Ad
The Most Realistic Game Of The Year
Try Mmorpg
call to action icon

“I had never seen anyone switch lanes in that tunnel,” says Sophia Yen,
a startup founder who was in her car behind the two autonomous ones this
past September. “It’s driving more like a taxi driver—an aggressive, New
York taxi driver.”

For years while training on the streets of San Francisco and eventually
transporting passengers, Waymos were the most polite drivers on the
road. Pull up to a stop sign at the same time as a Waymo and it would
wait, as if to say, “No, please, after you.” If you were trying to go
around another car making a left, a Waymo was sure to let you in. In
short, they were drivers you wouldn’t want to get stuck behind while in
a hurry.

The training wheels are off. Like the rule-following nice guy who’s
tired of being taken advantage of, Waymos are putting their own needs
first. They’re bending traffic laws, getting impatient with pedestrians
and embracing the idea that when it comes to city driving, politeness
doesn’t pay: It’s every car for itself.
Waymos appear to be putting their own needs first, bending traffic laws
and getting impatient with pedestrians. © Godofredo A. Vásquez/AP

In September, police in San Bruno, Calif., pulled over a Waymo after
witnessing it make an illegal U-turn. Last month, a Waymo hit and killed
a well-known neighborhood cat in the Mission district. On a recent
Thursday in Pacific Heights, a Waymo at a multilane four-way stop hit
the gas along with the car next to it so it wouldn’t have to wait its
turn. Seconds later, the same car decided signaling a lane change wasn’t
necessary.
Related video: Self-driving Waymo cars start testing in Philly as
residents raise concerns | PHL17 Morning News (WPHL Philadelphia)
Well, there's a new site on Philadelphia streets this morning.
Current Time 0:01
/
Duration 1:51
WPHL Philadelphia
Self-driving Waymo cars start testing in Philly as residents raise
concerns | PHL17 Morning News
0
View on WatchView on Watch

Jennifer Jeffries, 54, has logged nearly 3,000 minutes in Waymos since
May 2024. Until recently, the Pacific Heights resident wouldn’t take one
if she was headed downtown. They weren’t agile enough. She once got
stuck for several minutes behind another car that was double parked
while furniture was being unloaded.

She now has no problem taking Waymos downtown and finds they maneuver as
well as an Uber driver, maybe better.

“They will go around a car or get closer to a car than a human driver
would,” says Jeffries. “Sometimes I’ll be in the back seat and I’ll be
like, ‘Ooh that was really close.’”

One drawback: They seem to be mimicking Uber drivers in less-helpful
ways: “You say pick me up at this address and they’re across the street,
which I don’t appreciate,” she says.

Marc Schreiber, 49, liked it better when Waymos were strict followers of
traffic laws. While walking to the gym, Schreiber found himself in a
crosswalk opposite a Waymo. As soon as he’d made it past the front of
the vehicle, it started accelerating.
This free RPG Is Turning First-Time Players into Fans.
Ad
This free RPG Is Turning First-Time Players into Fans.
Try Mmorpg
call to action icon

“I was taken off guard,” says Schreiber. “My next thought was, oh
they’ve changed the programming to be more aggressive.”

He was right.

Waymo has been trying to make its cars “confidently assertive,” says
Chris Ludwick, a senior director of product management with Waymo, which
is owned by Google parent Alphabet. “That was really necessary for us to
actually scale this up in San Francisco, especially because of how busy
it gets.”

Ludwick says when the vehicles are too passive, they become disruptive.
Regular software updates ensure Waymos aren’t becoming a nuisance or
creating chaos.

Ludwick wouldn’t comment on specific incidents of rulebreaking. He says
Waymos make common-sense decisions, which involve trade-offs.
Waymo says it has been trying to make its cars more ‘confidently
assertive.’ © Getty Images

“The driver is designed to respect the rules of the road,” says Ludwick.
“However, sometimes this is a nuanced topic and road rules can even
conflict with each other.”

For example, he says, you’re not supposed to cross a double yellow line
but you also shouldn’t obstruct traffic. So if you get stuck behind a
stopped delivery truck, a human would go around it even if it meant
crossing the double line. Now Waymos know to do that, too.
Artisanal heritage. Made in Italy, as always
Ad
Artisanal heritage. Made in Italy, as always
Velasca
call to action icon

A Waymo spokeswoman says its vehicles have driven 100 million driverless
miles across San Francisco, Los Angeles, Austin, Phoenix and Atlanta.
The company reported that compared with human drivers, it has had 91%
fewer crashes involving a serious injury or worse.

Cossette Drossler, 65, says a friend recently told her about a Waymo
pulling a “California stop.” The car apparently slowed down but didn’t
reduce its speed to zero at an intersection.

Drossler, who lives in Pacific Heights and owns an accounting services
firm, feels conflicted on the evolving behavior. She doesn’t want to be
behind a Waymo that’s coming to a complete stop in a quiet neighborhood
when no one’s around. On the other hand, she doesn’t entirely trust them
to appropriately judge the risk.

“I do California rolling stops. I grew up in San Francisco,” says
Drossler, adding, “I only do it if it’s safe.”

Waymo says its cars are designed to come to a full stop.
There have been reports of Waymos doing the ‘California stop,’ which
involves not actually stopping. © Poppy Lynch for WSJ

Police Sgt. Scott Smithmatungol, who was on patrol in San Bruno one
September night, says he and his partner were looking for impaired
drivers when they got to talking about Waymos and how they were starting
to drive more like humans.

Just then, a Waymo opposite them in the intersection made a U-turn. The
pair looked up, saw the no-U-turn sign and put their lights on. The
Waymo pulled over. As Smithmatungol’s partner approached the driver’s
side window, it rolled down. A Waymo operator’s voice came on through a
speaker.

“They said they would look into it,” he says. “They were really, really
apologetic.” Currently, cops in California can’t cite a car without a
driver.

The law is about to change.

Write to Katherine Bindley at katie.bindley-at-wsj.com
--
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
http://www.mrbrklyn.com
DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002

http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www.brooklyn-living.com

Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and extermination camps,
but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013

_______________________________________________
Hangout mailing list
Hangout-at-nylxs.com
http://lists.mrbrklyn.com/mailman/listinfo/hangout

  1. 2025-12-01 Gabor Szabo <gabor-at-szabgab.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] [Perlweekly] #749 - Design Patterns in Modern Perl
  2. 2025-12-01 Ruben Safir <mrbrklyn-at-panix.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Copyright Wars being sent to the Supreme Court...
  3. 2025-12-01 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Mark Halegua (1953-2020), R.I.P.
  4. 2025-12-01 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Copyright Wars to shutdown internet access..
  5. 2025-12-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Restricting Healthcare access for Jews
  6. 2025-12-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Starbucks Strike
  7. 2025-12-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Shooting on Avenue J and East 16th Street near
  8. 2025-12-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] High Praise for Linux Desktops
  9. 2025-12-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] The death of the internet is finally making some
  10. 2025-12-02 mayer ilovitz <pmamayeri-at-gmail.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Shooting on Avenue J and East 16th Street
  11. 2025-12-02 From: "Free Software Foundation" <info-at-fsf.org> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] =?utf-8?q?Free_Software_Supporter_=E2=80=94_Is?=
  12. 2025-12-02 shulie <shulie_release-at-optimum.net> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Shooting on Avenue J and East 16th Street
  13. 2025-12-02 shulie <shulie_release-at-optimum.net> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Shooting on Avenue J and East 16th Street
  14. 2025-12-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Shooting on Avenue J and East 16th Street
  15. 2025-12-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] [Jewish] Shooting on Avenue J and East 16th
  16. 2025-12-03 From: "HealthExecWire" <press-at-healthexecwire.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Virtual HIPAA Summit 43 Agenda-at-a-Glance Now
  17. 2025-12-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Self Driving Cars are coming soon..
  18. 2025-12-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Cybertech the NSA and Israel
  19. 2025-12-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Resist Mamdani
  20. 2025-12-07 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Resist Mamdani
  21. 2025-12-07 mayer ilovitz <pmamayeri-at-gmail.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Resist Mamdani
  22. 2025-12-07 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Has anyone seen Tilly Norwood?
  23. 2025-12-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] wireguard
  24. 2025-12-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] wireguard
  25. 2025-12-07 Javier <je-vv-at-e.email> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] [artix-general] Proton VPN
  26. 2025-12-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] [artix-general] Proton VPN
  27. 2025-12-08 aqua <aqua-at-iserlohn-fortress.net> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] [artix-general] Proton VPN
  28. 2025-12-07 Javier <je-vv-at-e.email> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] [artix-general] Proton VPN
  29. 2025-12-07 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] [artix-general] Proton VPN
  30. 2025-12-07 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] [artix-general] Proton VPN
  31. 2025-12-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] [artix-general] Proton VPN
  32. 2025-12-11 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] WHen you are a hammer - everything is a nail
  33. 2025-12-11 Ruben Safir <mrbrklyn-at-panix.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] You want to laugh....
  34. 2025-12-11 From: "Eko Kai Alanah Owen, FSF" <info-at-fsf.org> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Problems with lax licenses,
  35. 2025-12-15 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] The reality of 5 thousand dollar drugss is the
  36. 2025-12-17 From: "Free Software Foundation" <info-at-fsf.org> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Your digital life isn't yours: The hidden battle
  37. 2025-12-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] The Adderal scheme bring jail sentences and
  38. 2025-12-19 Ruben Safir <mrbrklyn-at-panix.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] [invite-at-mauritshuis.nl: Special preview & lecture
  39. 2025-12-21 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Before 9-11 there was the Citicorp collapse -
  40. 2025-12-22 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] How to resist Mamdani - in the Press
  41. 2025-12-22 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS]
  42. 2025-12-22 mayer ilovitz <pmamayeri-at-gmail.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] How to resist Mamdani - in the Press
  43. 2025-12-22 Gabor Szabo <gabor-at-szabgab.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] [Perlweekly] #752 - Marlin - OOP Framework
  44. 2025-12-22 From: "Eko Kai Alanah Owen, FSF" <info-at-fsf.org> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Revive the winter ghost story with the tale of
  45. 2025-12-25 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Open Source Project With Little Revenue In Talks
  46. 2025-12-25 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Jewish and the Arts today
  47. 2025-12-25 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] What is DAWA - removing Jews from history
  48. 2025-12-25 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] The MTA's new cattle cars
  49. 2025-12-25 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Controlling Medical Information
  50. 2025-12-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] I am increasingly talking to dead people..
  51. 2025-12-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] I am increasingly talking to dead people..
  52. 2025-12-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Hijacking the Term Genocide from the person who
  53. 2025-12-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] This is why you do NOT send F35s to Saudi Arabia
  54. 2025-12-28 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Those 90 days fills are killing patients
  55. 2025-12-28 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Lou Gerstner - Dead
  56. 2025-12-29 Gabor Szabo <gabor-at-szabgab.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] [Perlweekly] #753 - Happy New Year!

NYLXS are Do'ers and the first step of Doing is Joining! Join NYLXS and make a difference in your community today!