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DATE 2018-02-01

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DATE 2018-02-04
FROM Ruben Safir
SUBJECT Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Fwd: Re: [opensuse] Need new source for unix
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Date: Sun, 04 Feb 2018 09:57:25 -0800
From: L A Walsh
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To: Roger Price
CC: opensuse Mailing List
Subject: Re: [opensuse] Need new source for unix utils -- gnu has broken
another. (fwd)
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Roger Price wrote:
> On Fri, 2 Feb 2018, Linda Walsh wrote:
>
>> I've used grep to search for strings across all my mailboxes for
>> decades. Found out today, it randomly doesn't work based on whether
>> or not the file contains any text that doesn't comply with
>> POSIX. ...
>> I suppose no one else really does a quick search through all their
>> email this way any more. Though is this what you'd expect?
>
> This worried me since I use grep to search through mail archives. 42.3 includes
> grep 2.16 dated 2014-01-01. man grep for 2.16 says under the heading
> ENVIRONMENT VARIABLES:
>
> POSIXLY_CORRECT
> If set, grep behaves as POSIX requires; otherwise, grep behaves more like
> other GNU programs.
>
> The latest grep, 3.1, dated 2017-07-02, contains the same statement.
>
> Do you have POSIXLY_CORRECT set? If not, I would not expect to see grep
> enforcing POSIX.
----
Bingo.

This was what I said -- (I DO NOT have POSIXLY_CORRECT set in my ENV).
I pointed this out. I submitted this as a bug against grep only to have
it closed because the email sent to me doesn't conform to POSIX!
Specifically, see the "***"d statements
by Eric Blake, below, and my response to his closing out the bug...




-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Re: bug#30326: grep not searching through a text file
(thinking it binary)
Date: Fri, 02 Feb 2018 12:09:23 -0800
From: L A Walsh
CC: 30326-done-at-debbugs.gnu.org, GNU bug control
References: <5A74BC3F.1030401-at-tlinx.org>
<2c00563c-9347-c596-4ade-a87bd9262ca1-at-redhat.com>


Eric Blake wrote:
>
> tag 30326 notabug
>

> On 02/02/2018 01:30 PM, L. A. Walsh wrote:
>
>> I've used grep to search through my mbox-format emails for decades, but
>> I've run into a case where it seems to be ignore a text mailbox
>> because, I guess, it thinks it is "binary"
>
> Yes, that's correct.
>

>> If I used "-Par" it finds it.
>
> Yes, that's also correct.
>
>
>> It seems that grep believes the file to binary and ignores it, though
>> "file" calls it "text".
>>
>
> The file is conditionally text. The POSIX definition of a text file is
> one whose lines consist of valid characters in the current locale - but
> note this definition is locale-dependent! So a file that is text under
> one locale may be binary under another. When you are grepping a file
> encoded correctly for the current locale, you get the output you want;
> when you are grepping a file that contains encoding errors for the
> current locale, POSIX says behavior is undefined, so GNU grep warns you
> that the file is binary (in the current locale); and your use of -a
> tells grep to process it anyways. As 'file' reported that your file was
> using non-ISO extended-ASCII, it probable means the file was encoded for
> an 8-bit single-byte locale; and my guess is that you were running grep
> under a UTF-8 locale, and generally, UTF-8 treats 8-bit single-byte
> inputs as encoding errors. Hence the warning that your file is binary,
> under the current locale.
>
> You can also use 'LC_ALL=C grep' to force a locale where EVERY byte is a
> valid character, and thus where you will never encounter encoding errors
> (you may encounter OTHER things that make your file binary, such as
> embedded NULs, but that's a different matter).
>
>*** This behavior is documented and intentional, so I'm closing this as not
>*** a bug in the tracker. However, feel free to add further comments or
>*** questions to the thread.
>
> And perhaps we could tweak the grep diagnostics to clarify whether a
> file is binary because NUL bytes were encountered, vs. a file is binary
> because encoding errors were encountered.
>

Grep was around long before POSIX, as were most of the unix
utils.

Grep was able to find text strings in mboxes without a POSIX
definition telling it that it was "broken".
I don't want it displaying random binary that throws my
terminal into weird modes, which is why I skip binary
files. To have grep searching through some mailboxes
while skipping others, randomly based on what email
happens to be in the box at the time, is hardly a useful
utility.

I did not ask for POSIXLY_CORRECT -- if you need to have it be
POSIXLY Correct, then use the existing var, but grep is now
broken -- since POSIX doesn't define "text" files "out in the real
world", but only for files that adhere to the POSIX standard.

People don't write emails that adhere to the POSIX standard.

Also, FWIW, grep's manpage doesn't say it is limited to posix-only
files. It's summary says:
grep, egrep, fgrep - print lines matching a pattern

which it does not do. It doesn't say "print lines matching
a pattern only from POSIX text files.

------END "Original Message" --------

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  17. 2018-02-12 Jennifer <monster-at-candidate.monster.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Ruben,
  18. 2018-02-13 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] MTA failures and refund demands
  19. 2018-02-15 Daniel Baluta <daniel.baluta-at-gmail.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Announce Linux kernel labs project
  20. 2018-02-16 From: "Linux Journal Subscription" <subs-at-linuxjournal.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] We are Back. Are You Subscribed!
  21. 2018-02-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Movie of the Week
  22. 2018-02-18 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Movie of the week
  23. 2018-02-19 Gabor Szabo <gabor-at-szabgab.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] [Perlweekly] #343 - Grants and Crowd funding of
  24. 2018-02-19 Ben Creisler <bcreisler-at-gmail.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] [dinosaur] Dinosaur diversity--research history
  25. 2018-02-19 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] R Programming workshop to begin in Bushwick
  26. 2018-02-21 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Fwd: [SDF] VoIP Telephone is FUN!
  27. 2018-02-21 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Fwd: LibrePlanet 2018 is on the way: more talks
  28. 2018-02-22 mrbrklyn <mrbrklyn-at-panix.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] R workshop
  29. 2018-02-23 From: "Mancini, Sabin (DFS)" <Sabin.Mancini-at-dfs.ny.gov> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] R workshop: NL separates commands,
  30. 2018-02-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] openhardware
  31. 2018-02-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] [Learn] openhardware
  32. 2018-02-24 Ruben Safir <mrbrklyn-at-panix.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] [Learn] openhardware
  33. 2018-02-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] jobs
  34. 2018-02-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Ever see this
  35. 2018-02-26 Gabor Szabo <gabor-at-szabgab.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] [Perlweekly] #344 - Lost in the cloud
  36. 2018-02-25 ISOC-NY announcements <announce-at-lists.isoc-ny.org> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] [isoc-ny] Applications now open: ITS Global
  37. 2018-02-28 From: "Free Software Foundation" <info-at-fsf.org> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Inside the FSF: Our FY2016 Annual Report

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