Thu Apr 25 04:40:29 2024 EVENTS FREE SOFTWARE INSTITUTE POLITICS JOBS MEMBERS' CORNER MAILING LIST NYLXS Members have a lot to say and share but we don't keep many secrets. Join the Hangout Mailing List and say your peice. 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Mon, 5 Mar 2018 20:45:39 -0500 (EST) X-Original-To: hangout-at-www2.mrbrklyn.com Delivered-To: hangout-at-www2.mrbrklyn.com Received: by mrbrklyn.com (Postfix, from userid 1000) id 7E9E2161134; Mon, 5 Mar 2018 20:45:37 -0500 (EST) Resent-From: Ruben Safir Resent-Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2018 20:45:37 -0500 Resent-Message-ID: <20180306014537.GQ2765-at-www2.mrbrklyn.com> Resent-To: hangout-at-mrbrklyn.com X-Original-To: ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com Delivered-To: ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com Received: from omr1.cc.vt.edu (outbound.smtp.vt.edu [198.82.183.121]) by mrbrklyn.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id 5E839161132 for ; Sun, 4 Mar 2018 23:16:06 -0500 (EST) Received: from mr3.cc.vt.edu (mr3.cc.vt.edu [IPv6:2607:b400:92:8500:0:7f:b804:6b0a]) by omr1.cc.vt.edu (8.14.4/8.14.4) with ESMTP id w254G6mV003252 for ; Sun, 4 Mar 2018 23:16:06 -0500 Received: from mail-qt0-f198.google.com (mail-qt0-f198.google.com [209.85.216.198]) by mr3.cc.vt.edu (8.14.7/8.14.7) with ESMTP id w254G14V007712 for ; Sun, 4 Mar 2018 23:16:06 -0500 Received: by mail-qt0-f198.google.com with SMTP id g13so13226233qtj.15 for ; 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Sun, 04 Mar 2018 20:16:00 -0800 (PST) Received: from turing-police.cc.vt.edu ([2601:5c0:c001:4342:f962:5e05:19b5:1136]) by smtp.gmail.com with ESMTPSA id n187sm7857381qke.48.2018.03.04.20.15.58 (version=TLS1_2 cipher=ECDHE-RSA-CHACHA20-POLY1305 bits=256/256); Sun, 04 Mar 2018 20:15:58 -0800 (PST) From: valdis.kletnieks-at-vt.edu X-Google-Original-From: Valdis.Kletnieks-at-vt.edu X-Mailer: exmh version 2.8.0 04/21/2017 with nmh-1.7+dev To: Ruben Safir In-Reply-To: <80280427-f23e-ae30-a3cd-5230c7a5de06-at-mrbrklyn.com> References: <77520.1520202258-at-turing-police.cc.vt.edu> <80280427-f23e-ae30-a3cd-5230c7a5de06-at-mrbrklyn.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Date: Sun, 04 Mar 2018 23:15:58 -0500 Message-ID: <118179.1520223358-at-turing-police.cc.vt.edu> X-UID: 46784 Cc: kernelnewbies-at-kernelnewbies.org Subject: Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem X-BeenThere: hangout-at-nylxs.com X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.17 Precedence: list List-Id: NYLXS Tech Talk and Politics List-Unsubscribe: , List-Post: List-Help: List-Subscribe: , Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="===============0922501139==" Errors-To: hangout-bounces-at-nylxs.com Sender: "Hangout" --===============0922501139== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="==_Exmh_1520223358_14985P"; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --==_Exmh_1520223358_14985P Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii On Sun, 04 Mar 2018 21:21:13 -0500, Ruben Safir said: > I am not setting up a high availability cluster in my house, thank you. > And fwiw, I've run systems for 6-8 years without rebooting on pc > hardware. My little fanless fit/pc service running an intel atom had at > one time run 5 years without rebooting. I only had a system fry once > while it was up an running since the late 1990's until today, and in > that case it was wild power surge and the hardware was up and running in > 20 minutes with a swap out of the hard drive. The fact that you've kept a system going for 8 years without a reboot isn't proof that actually doing so is a good idea security wise. > The linux kernel is integrated into dozens of devices which never see > the light of day for kernel upgrades from PPOE routers, IOT devices, > cellphones, VOIP boxes, electrocardiograms, menu displays for McDonalds, > signal boxes on train systems, etc etc etc. The big problem *there* isn't that a reboot is often required. The problem is that the vendors won't ship a patched system to reboot *into*. > What has been described is a huge security problem and your solution is > a non-starter and doesn't help the broader problem. I repeat what I said - if you can't afford a reboot because it's mission critical, you can't afford to *not* be doing HA or load balancing or something. The Internet of Pwned Things problem is with systems where a reboot *is* feasible (are you going to notice if your light bulb reboots at 3AM when it's off anyhow?), but vendors have no ecomonic incentive to provide fixes after they've got your money (unless they can monetize you post-purchase - and most people won't pay for a support contract, so the vendor's only realistic choice is monetizing your data..) And that's a totally orthogonal issue. --==_Exmh_1520223358_14985P Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Comment: Exmh version 2.8.0 04/21/2017 iQEVAwUBWpzEfo0DS38y7CIcAQJ60wf+KU6jxFfFRvYssNvHe1t7r7CBU7noB3Cf b9OlLdkiBNZkhaI15LM5SprjMeAcj1Va8agMZ7x0jge0xPjnGguuIQorFG8gjR+X uX7x5e0DpvCb9TBedQUc3VxeQmaQHZ3sGHZ3h8nKqqRo2E9/jKvGEEkI9mfmPxYy x7ASOQckgBGsOvRicZx1ImmirjNKjOpl2BxHpGhBITWR5aIcDFDOgdiWo0534xNA B8EW/QtXWxFNrsy6Ia6EZc4/2a6uF9IhTpGI9h5amuUzt4Vdn3LYoZK6+4Fcrtme hgCj2eqpHb5ceEw5UK6arVzky4o071IIarQDB9Hcxx3GKIGPJed40A== =LenI -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --==_Exmh_1520223358_14985P-- --===============0922501139== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Hangout mailing list Hangout-at-nylxs.com http://lists.mrbrklyn.com/mailman/listinfo/hangout --===============0922501139==-- --===============0922501139== Content-Type: multipart/signed; boundary="==_Exmh_1520223358_14985P"; micalg=pgp-sha1; protocol="application/pgp-signature" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit --==_Exmh_1520223358_14985P Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii On Sun, 04 Mar 2018 21:21:13 -0500, Ruben Safir said: > I am not setting up a high availability cluster in my house, thank you. > And fwiw, I've run systems for 6-8 years without rebooting on pc > hardware. My little fanless fit/pc service running an intel atom had at > one time run 5 years without rebooting. I only had a system fry once > while it was up an running since the late 1990's until today, and in > that case it was wild power surge and the hardware was up and running in > 20 minutes with a swap out of the hard drive. The fact that you've kept a system going for 8 years without a reboot isn't proof that actually doing so is a good idea security wise. > The linux kernel is integrated into dozens of devices which never see > the light of day for kernel upgrades from PPOE routers, IOT devices, > cellphones, VOIP boxes, electrocardiograms, menu displays for McDonalds, > signal boxes on train systems, etc etc etc. The big problem *there* isn't that a reboot is often required. The problem is that the vendors won't ship a patched system to reboot *into*. > What has been described is a huge security problem and your solution is > a non-starter and doesn't help the broader problem. I repeat what I said - if you can't afford a reboot because it's mission critical, you can't afford to *not* be doing HA or load balancing or something. The Internet of Pwned Things problem is with systems where a reboot *is* feasible (are you going to notice if your light bulb reboots at 3AM when it's off anyhow?), but vendors have no ecomonic incentive to provide fixes after they've got your money (unless they can monetize you post-purchase - and most people won't pay for a support contract, so the vendor's only realistic choice is monetizing your data..) And that's a totally orthogonal issue. --==_Exmh_1520223358_14985P Content-Type: application/pgp-signature -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Comment: Exmh version 2.8.0 04/21/2017 iQEVAwUBWpzEfo0DS38y7CIcAQJ60wf+KU6jxFfFRvYssNvHe1t7r7CBU7noB3Cf b9OlLdkiBNZkhaI15LM5SprjMeAcj1Va8agMZ7x0jge0xPjnGguuIQorFG8gjR+X uX7x5e0DpvCb9TBedQUc3VxeQmaQHZ3sGHZ3h8nKqqRo2E9/jKvGEEkI9mfmPxYy x7ASOQckgBGsOvRicZx1ImmirjNKjOpl2BxHpGhBITWR5aIcDFDOgdiWo0534xNA B8EW/QtXWxFNrsy6Ia6EZc4/2a6uF9IhTpGI9h5amuUzt4Vdn3LYoZK6+4Fcrtme hgCj2eqpHb5ceEw5UK6arVzky4o071IIarQDB9Hcxx3GKIGPJed40A== =LenI -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --==_Exmh_1520223358_14985P-- --===============0922501139== Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline _______________________________________________ Hangout mailing list Hangout-at-nylxs.com http://lists.mrbrklyn.com/mailman/listinfo/hangout --===============0922501139==-- 2018-03-01 From: "Free Software Foundation" <info-at-fsf.org> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Free Software Supporter Issue 119, March 2018 2018-03-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-05 Greg KH <greg-at-kroah.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-05 From: "APhA's Pharmacy Today" <PTdaily-at-aphanet.org> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] March 5, 2018-03-01 From: "Canarsie Courier" <emailsentby-at-icontactmail.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Inside This Week's Edition of the Canarsie Courier 2018-03-05 Gabor Szabo <gabor-at-szabgab.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] [Perlweekly] #345 - Plenty of posts 2018-03-05 From: "IEEE ComSoc Meetings" <noreply-at-comsoc.org> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] IEEE GLOBECOM'18 Workshop Deadline Extended 2018-03-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-05 Greg KH <greg-at-kroah.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-05 Greg KH <greg-at-kroah.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-05 valdis.kletnieks-at-vt.edu Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-05 Greg KH <greg-at-kroah.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-05 Greg KH <greg-at-kroah.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-04 valdis.kletnieks-at-vt.edu Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-04 Alex Arvelaez <ealejandro-at-outlook.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-04 valdis.kletnieks-at-vt.edu Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-04 valdis.kletnieks-at-vt.edu Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-04 Greg KH <greg-at-kroah.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-04 Alex Arvelaez <ealejandro-at-outlook.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-04 valdis.kletnieks-at-vt.edu Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Year 2038 time set problem 2018-03-01 From: "SUSE" <news-at-suse.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] =?utf-8?q?Open_Source_Software=3A_There?= 2018-03-07 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Look Ma, I invented the internet 2018-03-07 Ruben <mrbrklyn-at-panix.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Best Scam 2018-03-08 James E Keenan <jkeenan-at-pobox.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] ny.pm technical meeting: Wed Mar 28 at MongoDB 2018-03-08 James E Keenan <jkeenan-at-pobox.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Perl Conference 2018 in Salt Lake City: 2018-03-06 From: "[RSS/Feed] nixCraft: Linux Tips, Hacks, Tutorials, Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] nixCraft Linux / UNIX Newsletter 2018-03-06 From: "Linux Journal Subscription" <subs-at-linuxjournal.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] March 2018 issue to be released next week! 2018-03-08 From: "Canarsie Courier" <emailsentby-at-icontactmail.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Inside This Week's Edition of the Canarsie Courier 2018-03-10 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Jobs are Rockerfeller University 2018-03-10 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Jobs at Colombia 2018-03-10 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] jobs at robots 2018-03-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Your Tax Dollars at Work 2018-03-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] The must significant news this week that will 2018-03-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] UDF Skywalker 2018-03-14 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] predictability and AI on PBS Nova 2018-03-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Fwd: Re: LKCAMP - Linux Kernel study group - 2018-03-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Fwd: [mothur] Reproducible Research Tutorials 2018-03-20 From: "Pat Schloss" <pschloss-at-umich.edu> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] [mothur] Reproducible Research Tutorials with 2018-03-20 Helen Fornazier <helen.fornazier-at-gmail.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] LKCAMP - Linux Kernel study group - volunteers 2018-03-20 Helen Fornazier <helen.fornazier-at-gmail.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] LKCAMP - Linux Kernel study group - volunteers 2018-03-18 Helen Fornazier <helen.fornazier-at-gmail.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] LKCAMP - Linux Kernel study group - volunteers 2018-03-12 Gabor Szabo <gabor-at-szabgab.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] [Perlweekly] #346 - Conferences, Workshops, 2018-03-19 Gabor Szabo <gabor-at-szabgab.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] [Perlweekly] #347 - Happy belated Pi day! 2018-03-19 James E Keenan <jkeenan-at-pobox.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Help get Perl 5.28 ready: test CPAN against dev 2018-03-21 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] urgent protest 2018-03-21 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] start the revolution 2018-03-21 From: "Georgia Young, FSF" <info-at-fsf.org> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] LibrePlanet 2018: Last update! 2018-03-21 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] hipsters don't have kids 2018-03-22 ruben <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] DNA as a computer 2018-03-23 Ruben Safir <mrbrklyn-at-panix.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Movie of the Week 2018-03-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Kill the Kings Highway SBS 2018-03-23 From: "Deutsch, Chaim" <CDeutsch-at-council.nyc.gov> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] THE DEUTSCH REPORT: News From Councilmember Chaim 2018-03-26 Gabor Szabo <gabor-at-szabgab.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] [Perlweekly] #348 - Submit a grant application 2018-03-25 James E Keenan <jkeenan-at-pobox.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Fwd: [Perl Conference NA Announce] The Perl 2018-03-26 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] check out this con artist on reddit 2018-03-26 From: "Mancini, Sabin (DFS)" <Sabin.Mancini-at-dfs.ny.gov> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] check out this con artist on reddit | | Need 2018-03-27 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] New GIMP release 2018-03-27 Ruben Safir <mrbrklyn-at-panix.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] This is not the NYLXS I was looking for 2018-03-27 James E Keenan <jkeenan-at-pobox.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] ny.pm technical meeting: Wed Mar 28 at MongoDB 2018-03-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] The Dream of a Free Phone ... 2018-03-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Happy Peasach and Holidays 2018-03-30 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] Private sector discrimination enmasse 2018-03-30 FarSight Data Systems <msh-at-farsight-data.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] Happy Peasach and Holidays 2018-03-09 Clive Holloway <clive.holloway-at-gmail.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] ny.pm technical meeting: Wed Mar 28 at MongoDB 2018-03-09 Clive Holloway <clive.holloway-at-gmail.com> Re: [Hangout - NYLXS] ny.pm technical meeting: Wed Mar 28 at MongoDB NYLXS are Do'ers and the first step of Doing is Joining! 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