|FROM ||Ruben Safir
|SUBJECT ||Re: [Hangout of NYLXS] The rising shoutdown of the electorate
|From hangout-bounces-at-nylxs.com Fri May 19 12:32:26 2017
Received: from www.mrbrklyn.com (www.mrbrklyn.com [188.8.131.52])
by mrbrklyn.com (Postfix) with ESMTP id B8A1C161313;
Fri, 19 May 2017 12:32:25 -0400 (EDT)
Received: by mrbrklyn.com (Postfix, from userid 1000)
id 07126161311; Fri, 19 May 2017 12:32:23 -0400 (EDT)
Date: Fri, 19 May 2017 12:32:23 -0400
From: Ruben Safir
To: Rick Moen
User-Agent: Mutt/1.5.21 (2010-09-15)
Subject: Re: [Hangout of NYLXS] The rising shoutdown of the electorate
List-Id: NYLXS Tech Talk and Politics
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
On Fri, May 19, 2017 at 12:38:44AM -0700, Rick Moen wrote:
> Quoting Ruben Safir (ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com):
> > http://www.theamericanconservative.com/articles/removing-trump-wont-sol=
> Ah, Patrick "I'll bet it sounded better in the original German"'s print
> magazine. But seriously, I respect and share their editorial stance and
> favour of fiscal conservatism, civil liberties, and a realist foreign
> policy based on military restraint and the national interest --
> paleoconservative values that I share with the editors, FWIW. (I also
> respect that they are genuinely non-partisan and not just a mouthpiece
> for the RNC or the current crop of GOP pols. But that makes it all the
> more bizarre that editor Merry is making a smokescreen for Trump, saying
> it's all his fight with the 'elites'.
> (FWIW, just to be clear, I agree with the magazine's stances more often
> than not. They tend to be the adults in the room.)
> Political elites in our system are real of course, but Trump isn't
> fighting so much with them as with everyone.
> Some believe it stems specifically from the election of
> Donald Trump, a man supremely unfit for the presidency [...]
> I'll bet you violently disagree with Merry on that, right? =
I disagree with many aspects of this article but I believe in the main
thrust of the argument which is that we have a stolic, entrenched
political class that is impossible to root out, even with direct
elections, and I do believe that electing Trump was a means of the
public to stick a finger in the eye of that elite.
Furthermore, I don't think one needs to brilent or proper to effecively
run the government.
AH Pook the Destoryer:
We have a new type of rule now. Not one man rule, or rule of
aristocracy, or plutocracy, but of small groups elevated to positions of
absolute power by random pressures and subject to political and economic
factors that leave little room for decision. They are representatives of
abstract forces who=E2=80=99ve reached power through surrender of self. The
iron-willed dictator is a thing of the past. There will be no more
Stalins, no more Hitlers. The rulers of this most insecure of all worlds
are rulers by accident inept, frightened pilots at the controls of a
vast machine they cannot understand, calling in experts to tell them
which buttons to push.
This is about were we are at. The government is completely unhinged and
remote from the electorate. We have a foreign government which is
vastly influencing US policy by paying off the government in that we
have China which owns aboiut 10% of the total US Debt to the tune of
about 1.27 tillion in dept holdings. =
Foreign governments hold about 46% of all U.S. debt held by the public,
more than $4.5 trillion. According to the Treasury, the largest foreign
holder of U.S. debt is China, which owns more than $1.24 trillion in
bills, notes, and bonds or about 30% of the over $4 trillion in Treasury
bills, notes, and bonds held by foreign countries. =
In total, China owns about 10% of publicly held U.S. debt. Of all the
holders of U.S. debt China is the third-largest, behind only the Social
Security Trust Fund's holdings of nearly $3 trillion and the Federal
Reserve's nearly $2 trillion holdings in Treasury investments, purchased
as part of its quantitative easing program to boost the economy.
The current $1.24 trillion in U.S. debt is actually slightly less than
the record $1.317 trillion held by China in 2013. Economists suggest the
decrease was due to China=E2=80=99s decision to reduce its U.S. holdings in
order to increase the value of its own currency.
That is a bog problem of foriegn inflluence that directly affects US
policy, even in Korea.
Fuck this witchhunt. THey should put Obama and Schmumer on trial.
> But you
> forgive that, because at least he gives cover for resentment against
> elites, which is part of your big thing. Overthrow the Washington
> elites by electing a man who... um... doesn't deliver on any of his
> campaign promises, but eviscerates environmental and banking safeguards,
> etc., always with the effect of windfall profits to... the elites.
> But you don't see that, and endorse Merry's deranged view that Trump is
> a 'political revolution', which against all evidence you believe to be
> poised to accomplish what you want, Real Soon Now.
> I have welcome news to you and Bob Merry: No, impeachment isn't going
> to go anyhere for the foreseeable future, because there just aren't the
> votes, especially not in the Senate. 25th Amendment, same story.
> Indictments of a lot of Administration figures, OTOH, seems quite
> Anyhow, as usual, I actually do agree with the basic thrust of Merry's
> At least Republican elites resisted the emergence of Trump for as long
> as they could.
> I do not concur. A principaled position would have been to back, say,
> Evan McMullin, and after that tent folded, to organize in opposition, =
> as Lindsay Graham and John McCain have done, among others. The power
> structure, instead, went all Stockholm Syndrome.
> Meanwhile, we have =E2=80=9Csanctuary cities=E2=80=9D throughout Blue S=
tate America =
> that are refusing to cooperate with federal officials seeking to =
> enforce the immigration laws =E2=80=94 the closest we have come as a na=
> to =E2=80=9Cnullification=E2=80=9D since the actual nullification crisi=
s of the 1830s, =
> when South Carolina declared its right to ignore federal legislation =
> it didn=E2=80=99t like.
> Bob Merry is either failing to do good research any more, or failing to
> pay his interns enough. The general model of 'sanctuary' statute =
> doesn't prohibit local officials from answering CBP's quetions if they
> wish. (Any statute that does violates Federal law.) The general model
> merely says that it's the policy of the city/county/whatever to not
> answer such questions, e.g., the San Francisco statute merely advises
> Sheriff's Dept. employees that they work for the City and County of San
> Francisco, and that they have no obligation to do free-of-charge work
> for CBP when they call and start asking about prisoners in the county
> And you know what classic conservative principle that embodies, one
> straight out of the Constitution? The Tenth Amendment. Read it, sir.
> Giving San Francisco Cigy and County jail officials orders is not a power
> delegated to the United States by the Constitution. Ergo, it is
> a power reserved to the City and County of San Francisco. The Feds
> cannot dragoon them into doing CBP work. CBP is free to do its own
> damned work, but we (and San Francisco's staff) are not the Feds' serfs.
> They can ask, and we can say 'No thank you.' Tenth Amendment, sir.
> I really expect a paleoconservative to understand conservative
> principles, so Bob Merry is letting the side down, here.
> And if they complain they find themselves confronting the forces of
> political correctness....
> With all the force of a wet noodle -- victim-narrative sob-story
> That=E2=80=99s why there is so much talk about impeachment even in th=
> absence of any evidence thus far of =E2=80=9Chigh crimes and misdemea=
> I expect better grasp of American political history from a
> paleoconservative. Again, Bob is letting us down. Long history has
> shown that the cited term in Article Two, section 4 is to be applied by
> Congress to anything it regards as major abuse of a Federal office -- =
> i.e., it's fundamentally a political concept more than a judicial one.
> But Merry can save the concern. It's not going to happen. Not without
> a big change from the present record.
> The president and his top foreign policy advisers, who were present
> during the conversation, say he didn=E2=80=99t. The media and Trump=E2=
> adversaries insist that he did, at least implicitly. We don=E2=80=99t k=
> We do know. Trump said so in his television interview (contraditing the
> lying cover stories several of his underlings had put out to make smoke
> for him; as usual, he threw his people under the bus).
> There is no way out for America at this point.
> Here is what I'd suggest, and would be my advice for the next two years
> to the DNC and similar folk: Let Trump be Trump. Let Ryan be spineless
> Ryan. Let McConnell be McConnell. Keep an accurate record of all the
> horrific things being done. (Be careful to be voted down in opposition
> to them.) Let things go to hell in a handbasket in pursuit of the
> make-everyone-but-the-0.1%-miserable GOP agenda. Make sure the voters
> understand who is augering the nation into the ground, particularly the
> 41.0% or didn't vote in Nov. 2016. =
> Ignore the 27.2% who tore themselves away from their conspiracy theories
> about First Lady Hillary murdering Commerce Secretary Ron Brown by
> waving a magic wand and making an Air Force B737 hit a mountain behind
> Dubrovnikjust long enough to pull the Trump/Pence lever. They're
> delusional and just need to be outvoted, so they can wander off and shout
> at clouds, or whatever else the terminally out of touch with reality do.
> Again, to re-stress, I basically _do_ agree with Bob.
> Hangout mailing list
So many immigrant groups have swept through our town
that Brooklyn, like Atlantis, reaches mythological
proportions in the mind of the world - RI Safir 1998
DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive =
http://www.coinhangout.com - coins!
Being so tracked is for FARM ANIMALS and and extermination camps, =
but incompatible with living as a free human being. -RI Safir 2013
Hangout mailing list