|FROM ||Ruben Safir
|SUBJECT ||Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] MySQL issues
|From owner-hangout-outgoing-at-mrbrklyn.com Sun Jan 3 20:47:50 2010
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Date: Sun, 3 Jan 2010 20:45:34 -0500
From: Ruben Safir
Subject: Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] MySQL issues
References: <20100101190841.GC559-at-panix.com> <20100101215450.GA21859-at-panix.com> <20100101215521.GA5063-at-panix.com>
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On Sat, Jan 02, 2010 at 08:37:13PM -0500, Paul Charles Leddy wrote:
> Ya, I am extremely divided.
> This is a historic event in my mind. Especially with the split between
> Monty/RMS vs Moglen/Groklaw.
> Grand history. Take your time. You don't have to choose sides. None of
> us may know enough. Ever.
> And. I think it is a learning experience for me to see that a lot
> comes down to where the money is, more than I thought. At least, that
> is the counter claim on both parts.
Money has always been a key factor. The maraige of IBM and GNU was one
of the key elements to GNU/Linux growth, and if they invested likewise
into the desktop, then I believe that even more benifit would have come.
There is no substitute, IMO, for having paid developers at your disposal
writing code that isn't "Cool" but just needed.
> I assume money is the root of all evil. That's besides the point, but
> might be a good stand to take in the end.
Nah - Money, beleive it or not, historically speaking, is the driving
for behind positive societal change and has been since the earliest
times and for the West, most critical since the early middle ages.
Business prevents wars that are unecessary, pushed the state to rational
decision making, shapes cultural mindset by encouraging tolerance and a
sense of shared community among different groups who would otherwise be
at each others throats. Its common in the West for people to be suspect
of motivations that aren't based on financial gain, and we often asume
that such claims are Full of shit, or worse, ideologically driven in a
fashion that will ultimately saddle us all with intolerance...and
historically that would be correct. We are much more secure with
bribery than Inquisitions.
> One big question for me is about monopoly. One of the means of
> maintaining the social system we have -- I am reading
> "Turbo-Capitalism by Luttwak, btw, I don't make these things up mysqlf
> -- is that no one should have an outright monopoly. That's agreed. We
> need to at least keep up appearances. So, remind me, what was the
> answer to the fact that Oracle will have a monopoly if they suck in
In that, there is no answer and that is a key problem whether there is a
GPL'ed piece of software involved or not.
> I am also skeptical -- if you are curious to know -- that MySQL's GPL
> status can't save in via forking. It would be historic, right?
> that no other huge project has forked and survived?
Not unless you consider Fedora and OpenSuse a "fork"
> Anyways, I think it would take a LOT of work, but Monty could do it,
> if he wanted, and people would go w/ him. What am I missing here? The
> large corporate perspective? Definitely. Enlighten me. Crazy?
I agree with you. The sale of MYSQL for a BILLION DOLLARS was also
historic and I believe that Monty can make a fork work...if he chose to.
> Can anyone clarify the dual-license deal in a paragraph w/ less than
> 10 sentences? I am still unsure on that measure.
See the comment I posted from Richard.