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DATE 2004-11-01

HANGOUT

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Key: Value:

Key: Value:

MESSAGE
DATE 2004-11-22
FROM Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS
SUBJECT Subject: [hangout] GNU/Linux Skills become more valuable
From owner-hangouts-destenys-at-mrbrklyn.com Mon Nov 22 15:20:11 2004
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Date: Mon, 22 Nov 2004 15:20:11 -0500
From: Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS
To: hangout-at-nylxs.com
Subject: [hangout] GNU/Linux Skills become more valuable
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Linux Unchained Linux use is growing faster than the talent pool needed
to support it. Here's how IT managers see the problem and what they're
doing about it.


Video: Decreasing the time, cost, risk associated with business
integration - Gartner analysts describe the benefits and the pitfalls
of application integration


News Story by Mary K. Pratt

NOVEMBER 22, 2004 (COMPUTERWORLD) - Customers of GAF3 Solutions tell the
technology services provider that they want to use Linux because they
hear it's reliable, robust and relatively inexpensive. But a customer
recently balked at the one-month delay to install a Linux server. Why
such a long wait? GAF3's Linux expert was overextended, says George
A. Fitch III, president and CEO of the Dover, N.H.-based company.

High demand has Fitch wondering if he should charge extra for
Linux-related work. If he does, he wouldn't be alone.

Linux is gaining ground so quickly that some companies are having
a hard time finding enough people to handle Linux-related work. And
those they do find charge a premium, according to The Yankee Group,
a market research firm in Boston. Skilled Linux administrators in major
metropolitan markets command 20% to 30% salary premiums over their Unix
and Windows counterpartsa fact that could diminish the cost savings that
many companies bank on when they switch to Linux.

"It's really hard to find good, qualified help that doesn't charge you
so much," says Laura DiDio, an analyst at Yankee Group.

Not all IT managers concur with that assessment, but they do agree that
the growth of Linux requires a retooling of tech workers. They can't throw
their Windows people into Linux projects without additional training,
and though Unix staffers can pick up Linux more quickly, even they need
time to get up to speed.

The Goods

Linux experts and enthusiasts cite a litany of skills that companies need
for Linux systems work. Experience with programming and documentation
is key. The ability to edit files and modify source code is important,
too. Management experience is another plus.

Linux Unchained Image Credit: Michael Miller Those skills aren't
overly difficult to find, says Michael J. Ciaraldi, a computer science
professor at Worcester Polytechnic Institute in Massachusetts. But other
skillsnamely expertise in networking and graphicsaren't so easy to locate.

"Another skill in Linux is you have to be willing to ask other people
for help," Ciaraldi adds. For those who do seek help, there are Web sites
and user groups that share information on how to use and modify Linux.

DiDio compares the skills needed for Linux today to those sought for
network administrators 15 or 20 years ago. "What you're basically looking
for is that eclectic network administrator or software developer from
circa 1988someone who knows lots of different things," she says.

While some say the lack of personnel with Linux expertise affects the
rate at which companies adopt the open-source system, others say IT
departments are finding the skills they need without much extra effort
or additional pay.

"If you have someone who has experience with other operating systems, I
don't think it's all that difficult switching over to Linux," Ciaraldi
says. "Conceptually, the commands are the same, the structure is
similar. It's just learning what the exact commands are to accomplishing
various tasks."

Tom Pratt, IT manager at Coastal Transportation Inc., a shipping company
in Seattle, agrees. He oversees a mixed environment that includes seven
Linux servers and two Linux desktops. Pratt says he had no problem
learning Linux, and he wouldn't expect to encounter any problems finding
skilled help if necessary. A Unix administrator could easily evolve into
a Linux administrator with self-directed training, Pratt says. "If you
can read, that's the primary skill you need," he adds.

Not So Fast

Not all companies are comfortable moving ahead with Linux without skilled
workers, however. Ciaraldi remembers one New Jersey company, which was
working with Worcester Polytech students, that decided against a Linux
server when it realized it didn't have in-house Linux expertise.

And for companies that like flexible IT staffs, Linux can present a
problem. "The hardest thing I'm finding is someone who is very good
in Linux and can support Windows," says Dan Agronow, vice president
of technology at The Weather Channel Interactive Inc., or Weather.com,
in Atlanta.

Agronow says he hasn't had any trouble finding staffers with Linux skills,
but those with both Linux expertise and Windows skills are rare. "Most
people aren't as broad as that," he says.

Like others, Agronow says he believes someone with Unix experience can
easily make the transition to Linux, but he suggests that the significant
differences between Windows and Unix/Linux could keep some companies
from adopting Linux. "If you were an all-Windows shop, maybe you don't
have the contacts to hire a Linux person," he says.

Besides, companies want more than Linux skills, experts say. They want
business experience, too. "It's certainly possible to hire junior systems
administrators who have great knowledge in Linux," says Mark Mellis,
a consultant at SystemExperts Corp., a Sudbury, Mass.-based provider of
network security consulting services.

"The place where you run into trouble is typically they know the
technical bits, but they don't understand the business," he says. "They
understand the details of the implementation, but they don't understand
the greater architectural details or the big picture. That's why they're
junior people."

Even companies that rely on their senior Unix workers for help with Linux
systems are encountering problems, DiDio says. "There's a presumption
that if these guys could do Unix, then Linux should not be that much
of a stretch for them. So they're throwing them into the trenches,"
but they're not always prepared to handle all the tinkering that needs
to be done, she says.

The famously collaborative Linux community tries to pooh-pooh this,
according to DiDio. "They'll say, 'We have thousands of developers who
will jump in and help out' " via Linux chat rooms and Web sites, she
says. "While that sounds very nice, that's not going to take the place
of skilled in-house staff."

For Now

While Unix people may be able to make the transition to Linux over time,
the shortage of skilled Linux personnel today is forcing some companies to
look to vendors for help. But DiDio says even the big Linux distributors
like Red Hat Inc. and Novell Inc. "don't have thousands of tech support
people" to meet growing demand for Linux-related services.

DiDio cites the case of a major stock exchange that switched from
Unix to Linux. The organization had to default to its hardware vendor,
Hewlett-Packard Co., for installation help and service. "This is how
people are going to make their money on Linuxselling the premium technical
service and support," she says.

And while that window of opportunity won't last forever, it may exist
for the foreseeable future.

"I think there will be more demand as deployment continues," says Dick
Mackey, principal at SystemExperts. "And I think the demand will increase
before the supply of skilled people will be available. It will be a good
market for those people."

Meanwhile, companies are trying to close the Linux skills gap by sending
staffers for training and hiring new people specifically for their Linux
experience. "And some of the smaller companies are asking employees to
go out and teach themselves," says Ciaraldi.

Peter Childers, vice president of global learning services at Raleigh,
N.C.-based Red Hat, says he has seen demand for the company's Linux
training and certification courses increase dramatically. Today, there are
more than 12,800 Red Hat Certified Engineers and 5,900 Red Hat Certified
Technicians, a designation launched in January 2003. And 97% of people
attending training are sponsored by their companies, Childers says.

As manager of technical support at Boscov's Department Store LLC in
Reading, Pa., Joe Poole oversees about 85 IT staffers, five of whom
maintain the company's Linux system. He sent two staffers to a one-week
Linux training course run by IBM, paying about $5,000 for both to
attend. Those two workers now train colleagues in Linux.

"There's a scarcity of people who are absolutely trained in Linux, and
that's all they do," Poole says. "But there's no scarcity of people who
can pick it up."

Even so, Linux personnel seem increasingly valuable. Regardless of how
you increase the level of Linux expertise in your IT shop, beware of
companies that might try to raid your staff, particularly competitors
in your industry, DiDio says. "Make [workers] sign on the dotted line
if you train them that they'll stay with you for a year or two," she says.

Pratt is a freelance writer in Waltham, Mass. You can contact her at
markmary-at-mindspring.com.
--
__________________________
Brooklyn Linux
Solutions

So many immigrant groups have swept through our town that Brooklyn, like
Atlantis, reaches mythological proportions in the mind of the world -
RI Safir 1998

DRM is THEFT - We are the STAKEHOLDERS - RI Safir 2002
http://fairuse.nylxs.com

http://www.mrbrklyn.com - Consulting http://www.inns.net <-- Happy
Clients http://www.nylxs.com - Leadership Development in Free Software
http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/resources - Unpublished Archive or stories and
articles from around the net http://www2.mrbrklyn.com/downtown.html -
See the New Downtown Brooklyn....

____________________________
NYLXS: New Yorker Free Software Users Scene
Fair Use -
because it's either fair use or useless....
NYLXS is a trademark of NYLXS, Inc

  1. 2004-11-14 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] LUG in Denver
  2. 2004-11-14 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Arafat Dead - and the beat goes on..
  3. 2004-11-14 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Arafat Dead - and the beat goes on..
  4. 2004-11-13 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Open-source advocate Chris Stone unexpectedly leaves Novell
  5. 2004-11-11 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Arafat Dead
  6. 2004-11-11 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Arafat Dead
  7. 2004-11-10 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Arafat Dead
  8. 2004-11-10 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Airforce Hi-Tech Commercial
  9. 2004-11-09 Adam Kosmin <akosmin-at-nyc.rr.com> Re: [hangout] Airforce Hi-Tech Commercial
  10. 2004-11-09 Michael Richardson <MRichardson-at-abc.state.ny.us> Subject: [hangout] FW: retirement 401-keg
  11. 2004-11-09 Adam Kosmin <akosmin-at-nyc.rr.com> Subject: [hangout] firefox 1.0
  12. 2004-11-09 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Open House Meeting
  13. 2004-11-09 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Tech Night Returns!
  14. 2004-11-09 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Airforce Hi-Tech Commercial
  15. 2004-11-08 Michael Richardson <MRichardson-at-abc.state.ny.us> Subject: [hangout] FW: Gnubies Wed. Nov. 11, 2004 Davydd Harries on Languages in Fre
  16. 2004-11-08 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Novell launches an enterprise Linux desktop
  17. 2004-11-06 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] tech night
  18. 2004-11-06 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] tech night
  19. 2004-11-06 Adam Kosmin <akosmin-at-nyc.rr.com> Re: [hangout] More FS jobs
  20. 2004-11-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] More FS jobs
  21. 2004-11-05 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Novell counters Microsoft's Linux 'facts' with 'truth'
  22. 2004-11-05 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Open-source advocate Chris Stone unexpectedly leaves Novell
  23. 2004-11-05 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Warnings On New Phishing Threat Nov. 3, 2004
  24. 2004-11-05 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Keep an Eye on Your Linux Systems with Netstat
  25. 2004-11-05 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Important Message: BOYCOTT LINUXTODAY.COM
  26. 2004-11-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] New Website Advice
  27. 2004-11-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: Ruben, we are looking for a Linux guru to work at our company!
  28. 2004-11-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Open House - Date
  29. 2004-11-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [hangout] Open House - Date
  30. 2004-11-04 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] Open House - Date
  31. 2004-11-04 Adam Kosmin <akosmin-at-nyc.rr.com> Re: [hangout] Open House - Date
  32. 2004-11-04 Michael Richardson <MRichardson-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] New Website Advice
  33. 2004-11-04 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] New Website Advice
  34. 2004-11-03 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Open House - Date
  35. 2004-11-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] FW: TRIVIA
  36. 2004-11-03 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Adobe dipping toes into desktop Linux waters
  37. 2004-11-03 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] business (fwd)
  38. 2004-11-03 Michael Richardson <MRichardson-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] Adobe dipping toes into desktop Linux waters
  39. 2004-11-03 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] business (fwd)
  40. 2004-11-03 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] FW: TRIVIA
  41. 2004-11-02 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] business (fwd)
  42. 2004-11-02 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] FW: TRIVIA
  43. 2004-11-02 Michael Richardson <MRichardson-at-abc.state.ny.us> Subject: [hangout] FW: TRIVIA
  44. 2004-11-02 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [Fwd: ACSS CT and NYC Meeting: JPEGs, Viruses and Your System's
  45. 2004-11-01 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] Paging Rob M and Even I.
  46. 2004-11-01 From: "P.Robert Marino" <rob-at-concord-hs.org> RE: [hangout] Paging Rob M and Even I.
  47. 2004-11-01 From: "rc" <ray-pub-at-rcn.com> RE: [hangout] Suse cd
  48. 2004-11-01 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] Paging Rob M and Even I.
  49. 2004-11-30 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [Fwd: [FCNYC] Computer ONLY for non-profit!!!] (fwd)
  50. 2004-11-30 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Microsoft upgrade knocks out 80,000 government PCs
  51. 2004-11-29 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Some good political action advise
  52. 2004-11-29 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Flyer Distribution - Tuesday meeting
  53. 2004-11-29 Michael Richardson <MRichardson-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] Flyer Distribution - Tuesday meeting
  54. 2004-11-29 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] Flyer Distribution - Tuesday meeting
  55. 2004-11-28 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Flyer Distribution - Tuesday meeting
  56. 2004-11-28 Ron Guerin <ron-at-vnetworx.net> Re: [hangout] Flyer Distribution - Tuesday meeting
  57. 2004-11-28 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] RUBEN! I borrowered your Klezmagic CD and copied it! Not Your Scotch. Please do not call the Cops!
  58. 2004-11-28 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Open House Materials
  59. 2004-11-28 swd <sderrick-at-optonline.net> Subject: [hangout] RUBEN! I borrowered your Klezmagic CD and copied it! Not Your Scotch.
  60. 2004-11-28 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Flyer Distribution - Tuesday meeting
  61. 2004-11-28 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Flyer Distribution - Tuesday meeting
  62. 2004-11-28 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] need car
  63. 2004-11-28 bluecitabria <bluecitabria-at-airbatic.com> Subject: [hangout] unsubscribe
  64. 2004-11-28 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] need car
  65. 2004-11-28 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] need car
  66. 2004-11-28 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] New trolling sight for the argumentitive
  67. 2004-11-28 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Novel Desktop Linux
  68. 2004-11-27 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] In NY, Money Can't Buy Love But Gets a Foot in Door (fwd)
  69. 2004-11-27 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Microsoft Linux (fwd)
  70. 2004-11-27 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] NYLXS Open House Flyers]
  71. 2004-11-26 Michael Richardson <MRichardson-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] NYLXS Open House Flyers
  72. 2004-11-25 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] NYLXS Open House Flyers
  73. 2004-11-25 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] NYLXS Open House Flyers
  74. 2004-11-25 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Thanks Giving Day Wishes
  75. 2004-11-24 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] NYLXS Open House Flyers
  76. 2004-11-24 Ron Guerin <ron-at-vnetworx.net> Re: [hangout] NYLXS Open House Flyers
  77. 2004-11-24 swd <sderrick-at-optonline.net> Re: [hangout] NYLXS Open House Flyers
  78. 2004-11-24 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] NYLXS Open House Flyers
  79. 2004-11-24 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] NYLXS Open House Flyers
  80. 2004-11-24 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] C/C++ coding problem.
  81. 2004-11-24 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] C/C++ coding problem.
  82. 2004-11-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [hangout] NY & CT Meeting: The Art of Public Relations for Em
  83. 2004-11-23 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] NY & CT Meeting: The Art of Public Relations for Emplyees, Consultants, and Business Owners
  84. 2004-11-23 Michael Richardson <MRichardson-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] NY & CT Meeting: The Art of Public Relations for Em
  85. 2004-11-23 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] NY & CT Meeting: The Art of Public Relations for Emplyees, Consultants, and Business Owners
  86. 2004-11-23 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] Federal Programs Technology Centers Money
  87. 2004-11-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Federal Programs Technology Centers Money
  88. 2004-11-23 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Federal Programs Technology Centers Money
  89. 2004-11-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Hardware Pick Up
  90. 2004-11-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [hangout] Tech Night, Flyers and Classes
  91. 2004-11-23 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Tech Night, Flyers and Classes
  92. 2004-11-23 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Tech Night, Flyers and Classes
  93. 2004-11-23 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] Tech Night, Flyers and Classes
  94. 2004-11-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Plans for Flyer Distriubtion
  95. 2004-11-23 Adam Kosmin <akosmin-at-nyc.rr.com> Re: [hangout] C/C++ coding problem.
  96. 2004-11-23 Adam Kosmin <akosmin-at-nyc.rr.com> Re: [hangout] Plans for Flyer Distriubtion
  97. 2004-11-23 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] C/C++ coding problem.
  98. 2004-11-23 swd <sderrick-at-optonline.net> Subject: [hangout] C/C++ coding problem.
  99. 2004-11-22 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [MLUG] November 13, 2004 Meeting Notes
  100. 2004-11-22 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Plans for Flyer Distriubtion
  101. 2004-11-22 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Tech Night, Flyers and Classes
  102. 2004-11-22 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Re: Upcoming Hearings by the Committee on Technology in Government of the New York City Council Repost
  103. 2004-11-22 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Re: Upcoming Hearings by the Committee on Technology in Government of the New York City Council Repost
  104. 2004-11-22 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] Tech Night, Flyers and Classes
  105. 2004-11-22 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Re: Upcoming Hearings by the Committee on Technology
  106. 2004-11-22 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Re: Upcoming Hearings by the Committee on Technology in Government of the New York City Council Repost
  107. 2004-11-22 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Re: Upcoming Hearings by the Committee on Technology
  108. 2004-11-22 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Free Software Institute: Classes
  109. 2004-11-22 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] GNU/Linux Skills become more valuable
  110. 2004-11-22 Ron Guerin <ron-at-vnetworx.net> Re: [hangout] Yellow Dog Linux 4.0 Available for Download
  111. 2004-11-22 Ron Guerin <ron-at-vnetworx.net> Re: [hangout] "Linux World" - Time for a Boycott
  112. 2004-11-22 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Yellow Dog Linux 4.0 Available for Download
  113. 2004-11-22 Michael Richardson <MRichardson-at-abc.state.ny.us> Subject: [hangout] FW: Be Happy!
  114. 2004-11-22 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Yellow Dog Linux 4.0 Available for Download
  115. 2004-11-22 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Re: Upcoming Hearings by the Committee on Technology
  116. 2004-11-22 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Tech Night, Flyers and Classes
  117. 2004-11-22 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Tech Night, Flyers and Classes
  118. 2004-11-21 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Re: Upcoming Hearings by the Committee on Technology
  119. 2004-11-21 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Local Press
  120. 2004-11-21 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Local Press
  121. 2004-11-21 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] "Linux World" - Time for a Boycott
  122. 2004-11-21 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] SCO and and FUD leads to resignations
  123. 2004-11-21 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Radio Show Archive
  124. 2004-11-21 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] flyers
  125. 2004-11-21 Adam Kosmin <akosmin-at-nyc.rr.com> Subject: [hangout] flyers
  126. 2004-11-21 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [nylxs-announce] Weekly NYLXS Announcments
  127. 2004-11-21 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  128. 2004-11-21 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  129. 2004-11-21 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  130. 2004-11-20 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  131. 2004-11-20 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  132. 2004-11-20 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  133. 2004-11-20 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  134. 2004-11-20 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  135. 2004-11-20 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  136. 2004-11-20 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  137. 2004-11-20 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  138. 2004-11-20 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  139. 2004-11-20 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  140. 2004-11-20 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  141. 2004-11-20 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  142. 2004-11-20 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  143. 2004-11-20 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  144. 2004-11-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Trimming an MP3
  145. 2004-11-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  146. 2004-11-20 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  147. 2004-11-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  148. 2004-11-20 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  149. 2004-11-20 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  150. 2004-11-20 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Subject: [hangout] Perl vs. PHP
  151. 2004-11-20 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Re: Upcoming Hearings by the Committee on Technology
  152. 2004-11-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Tonights NYLXS Radio Show - Reading Tea Leaves in Corperate IT
  153. 2004-11-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] More Nukes Needed for ME
  154. 2004-11-20 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Call me 1-718-715-1771
  155. 2004-11-20 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Need more $$$ thinkers at Tech Night!
  156. 2004-11-20 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] GNU/Linux Scene Calender for Today
  157. 2004-11-19 swd <sderrick-at-optonline.net> Subject: [hangout] Need more $$$ thinkers at Tech Night!
  158. 2004-11-19 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Need more $$$ thinkers at Tech Night!
  159. 2004-11-19 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Need more $$$ thinkers at Tech Night!
  160. 2004-11-19 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] [brantley-at-coraid.com: I would like to give a talk t o the New York Linux Scene]
  161. 2004-11-19 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] [brantley-at-coraid.com: I would like to give a talk t o
  162. 2004-11-19 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Sun's Solaris 10 Launch - The Good, The Bad, and the Ugly
  163. 2004-11-19 From: "P.Robert Marino" <rob-at-concord-hs.org> Re: [hangout] Re: Upcoming Hearings by the Committee on Technology in Government of the New York City Council.
  164. 2004-11-19 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [brantley-at-coraid.com: I would like to give a talk to the New York Linux Scene]
  165. 2004-11-18 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Re: Upcoming Hearings by the Committee on Technology
  166. 2004-11-18 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [moyses-at-inpa.gov.br: How to join?]
  167. 2004-11-18 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: [marsee-at-oreilly.com: Word Annoyances Needed for New Book]
  168. 2004-11-18 From: "P.Robert Marino" <rob-at-concord-hs.org> Re: [hangout] Re: Upcoming Hearings by the Committee on Technology in Government of the New York City Council.
  169. 2004-11-18 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Review: OpenBSD 3.6 shows steady improvement
  170. 2004-11-18 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: [marsee-at-oreilly.com: Word Annoyances Needed for New Book]
  171. 2004-11-17 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: Learning all about Linux
  172. 2004-11-17 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Radio Show Saturday Night
  173. 2004-11-16 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] NYC'S SECRET GUIDE ON FIRING TEACHERS
  174. 2004-11-16 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Fedora Core 3 vs. Suse 9.2 Professional
  175. 2004-11-16 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Need suggestions. 3D development software for Linux/Unix.
  176. 2004-11-16 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Arafat Dead - and the beat goes on..
  177. 2004-11-16 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] Re: Fwd: NY Holiday Event
  178. 2004-11-16 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] Arafat Dead - and the beat goes on..
  179. 2004-11-16 swd <sderrick-at-optonline.net> Subject: [hangout] Need suggestions. 3D development software for Linux/Unix.
  180. 2004-11-15 From: "P.Robert Marino" <rob-at-concord-hs.org> Re: [hangout] Re: OpenOffice
  181. 2004-11-15 From: "P.Robert Marino" <rob-at-concord-hs.org> Re: [hangout] Open House Schedule and Preparation
  182. 2004-11-15 From: "P.Robert Marino" <rob-at-concord-hs.org> Re: [hangout] Re: Upcoming Hearings by the Committee on Technology in Government of the New York City Council.
  183. 2004-11-15 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: OpenOffice
  184. 2004-11-15 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Open House Schedule and Preparation
  185. 2004-11-15 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: Upcoming Hearings by the Committee on Technology in Government of the New York City Council.
  186. 2004-11-15 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: [marsee-at-oreilly.com: Word Annoyances Needed for New Book]
  187. 2004-11-15 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: [marsee-at-oreilly.com: Word Annoyances Needed for New Book]
  188. 2004-11-15 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: Fwd: NY Holiday Event
  189. 2004-11-15 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Arafat Dead - and the beat goes on..
  190. 2004-11-15 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Worse than Al-Quada!
  191. 2004-11-15 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] FW: [Fwd: Attention MICHAEL RICHARDSON This is your Final Notice of Domain Extension]
  192. 2004-11-15 Michael Richardson <MRichardson-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] FW: [Fwd: Attention MICHAEL RICHARDSON This is your
  193. 2004-11-15 Ron Guerin <ron-at-vnetworx.net> RE: [hangout] FW: [Fwd: Attention MICHAEL RICHARDSON This is your
  194. 2004-11-15 Michael Richardson <MRichardson-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] FW: [Fwd: Attention MICHAEL RICHARDSON This is your
  195. 2004-11-15 Walt Costanza <wjc-at-retsambew.com> Subject: [hangout] FW: [Fwd: Attention MICHAEL RICHARDSON This is your Final Notice of Domain Extension]
  196. 2004-11-15 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] Arafat Dead - and the beat goes on..

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