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DATE 2006-06-01

HANGOUT

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Key: Value:

Key: Value:

MESSAGE
DATE 2006-06-05
FROM Ruben Safir
SUBJECT Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] DRM is Theft: Disabling Information
DRM shows its evil after provider plans disabling bought music
Posted by Seán Byrne on 02 June 2006 - 01:06 - Source: ZDNet - Blogs

Most consumers of DRM crippled music download services are well aware of
at least some of the restrictions in place, such as being limited to
listening to their music on certain PCs to what players one may transfer
their music to. However, what some may not realise is that these
restrictions are not fixed and may be freely changed depending on
the service provider. For example, imagine the record labels deciding
all the sudden to start taking CDs off consumers because they decided
they are no longer entitled to keep their legally purchased CDs, well
this seems to be exactly what is happening with a few Dutch OD2 based
providers in the Netherlands when it comes to music purchased as
downloads.

For example, one Dutch broadband provider which runs a music service by
LoudEye offers a choice of ways to listen to its music - Stream,
Download for PC playback, Download+ for PC & media player support and a
30 second fragment. Unfortunately, consumers who purchased music as
downloads using the service have only recently found out that the music
they purchased may no longer be playable after January 1st 2007 after
the record labels decided to no longer support the downloading of music
on the store's service.

This is not the first time content providers have decided to revoke
content from providers, for example, consumers with TiVo’s who recorded
a certain eiposide of the Simpsons or King of the Hill lost the right
the right to playback their recordings after the content provider
apparently decided to no longer allow the playback of these (despite the
Simpsons issue being called a “bug”). Thanks to mrdataNY for letting us
know about the following news:

One of the lesser discussed but equally troubling evils of digital
rights management technology is what I call the "DRM switcheroo." The
DRM switcheroo is where the person or company sitting at the DRM
controls over the content you've accumulated under one set of rules
switches to a new set of rules. What, you don't like the rules? Tough
noogies. Because such DRM controls exist, content licensors and
providers can pretty much decide to have their way with the content you
think you have a right to use.

(further down within an e-mail about the Dutch ISP)

I would say that they're making an absolute case for totally getting rid
of the DRM as they are actually taking away the possibility to listen to
the music you've legally bought. It might have been bought via a cheap
method, but legally, you where entitled to listen to it on your PC. The
only possible means to still listen to your [downloaded] music would
actually mean that you've got to disconnect your PC from the Net as then
they won't be able to update the licensed files (assuming that they have
not already done so).

The idiocy of course is that you've bought a product which the seller
than decides he doesn't want to support anymore and then revokes your
license using DRM.

The full article can be read here. C|net gives further examples of
various problems experienced with DRM in this article.



This is just another example of how badly DRM is going out of hand. For
example, in this case it is like the record labels coming to knock on
their customer’s doors to demand their CDs back saying that they have
decided that consumers no longer have the right to keep these CDs. With
DRM, this is straight forward to do, since the player needs to
authenticate with the content providers server to check the song’s
licensing, at least for the first playback.

mrdataNY added: This really high lights a major problem with DRM and
the draconian methods of the "powers that be". People work hard for the
money in which they receive and when they follow the rules... they are
punished by it. Where would that same person go the next time?.... hmmm



Send to friend!Print
Microsoft criticizes Sony for including Blu-ray in PS3
InterVideo WinDVD installations top 175 million





Reactions on this item
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Reaction Posted by LastStand on 02 June 2006 - 03:01 | Moderated -at- 1 |

This is guess this is
the new business model,
pay, then pay and maybe
pay again. DRM makes
this all possible and if
you don't like it, soon
there will be no way to
get music from even the
radio. Guess you will
have to do without and
if you use p2p there
will be long stays in
jail or they will sue
you so that you don't
have the money to feed
yourself.
[edited by LastStand on
02.06.2006 03:04]



Reaction Posted by Hypnosis4U2NV on 02 June 2006 - 04:21 | Moderated -at- 1
|

A new acronym for DRM -
Doesnt Really Matter..

They will never get it..



Reaction Posted by CowboySlim on 02 June 2006 - 06:52 | Moderated -at- 1 |

Doesn't Really Matter to
me, either.
When I purchase a
download, I assume a
somewhat degraded final
product. So, while still
logged in, I burn it out
once as CD Audio and the
rip it back in as
160Kbps WMA or MP3 which
is no longer DRM'd. My
main use is in a $100
boombox primarily
outdorrs while camping
and the fidelity loss is
imperceptible. So it
Doesn't Really Matter
anyway.



Reaction Posted by yronnen on 02 June 2006 - 19:17 | Moderated -at- 1 |

What did you expect? The
purpose of DRM was never
to stop piracy (even if
that's what the media
provider said), but to
create a constant
revenue stream.

The best way to create a
revenue stream is by
selling a service, not a
product. They sell you
the songs as a service
(i.e. it will play for a
month), and if you want
to listen some more,
pull out this credit
card of yours.



Reaction Posted by rla on 02 June 2006 - 23:19 | Moderated -at- 1 |

...and just like the
greed mongers in the
industry, I'm betting
the dumb ass public will
just keep on spending
their money while they
get less and less.

It is a shame how easy
it is to manipulate a
modern society like they
are a bunch of
sheep...just incredible.



Reaction Posted by greg42 on 03 June 2006 - 22:59 | Moderated -at- 1 |

Oh and what about your
fair use rights ? And I
always believed DRM
stood for Draconian
Rights Mangled



Reaction Posted by maximumpayne on 04 June 2006 - 16:29 | Moderated -at- 1
|

No wonder P2P usage is
going up already. The
more they keep up their
path of tyranny, the
more they'll go down in
flames.

P.S.: In case you people
didn't know, there are
methods and/or
freeware/opensource
programs to remove DRM.
You can always do a
google search for those.



Reaction Posted by Nil Einne on 05 June 2006 - 04:06 | Moderated -at- 1 |

I'm surprised this isn't
againt Dutch consumers
laws. Or maybe it is and
the company is simply
hoping nothing will be
done about it...


  1. 2006-06-01 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Sweeedish Meatballs
  2. 2006-06-01 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] I am starting a new outreach for free software effort.
  3. 2006-06-01 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [rguerin-at-nylug.org: [nylug-talk] [nylug-job] Queens DA needs Linux Engineer IMMEDIATELY]
  4. 2006-06-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com: Re: [nylug-talk] I am starting a new outreach for free software effort.]
  5. 2006-06-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] DRm is Theft and the FSF
  6. 2006-06-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Next General Meeting
  7. 2006-06-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] PDF Poison
  8. 2006-06-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] DRM Laptops
  9. 2006-06-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] DRM is Theft II
  10. 2006-06-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] DRM in every Laptop
  11. 2006-06-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Next General Meeting
  12. 2006-06-02 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Distro ISO
  13. 2006-06-03 MLR <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Join me in standing up for New York's national monuments!
  14. 2006-06-03 myc <mlr52-at-mycouponmagic.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Next General Meeting
  15. 2006-06-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Next General Meeting
  16. 2006-06-03 MLR <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Next General Meeting
  17. 2006-06-03 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Next General Meeting
  18. 2006-06-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS General Membership Meeting
  19. 2006-06-04 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [bruce.lai-at-council.nyc.ny.us: E-Update for the Committee on Technology in Government of New York City Council (June 4, 2006).]
  20. 2006-06-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] DRM is Theft: IPODS
  21. 2006-06-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] DRM is Theft: Disabling Information
  22. 2006-06-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] DRM is Theft: Blue Ray
  23. 2006-06-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] DRM is Theft: BBC
  24. 2006-06-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Mail Archives
  25. 2006-06-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] DRm is Theft and the FSF
  26. 2006-06-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] CRAP
  27. 2006-06-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] WTC Rebuilding
  28. 2006-06-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [joshua.mcadams-at-gmail.com: YAPC::NA]
  29. 2006-06-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] teaching volunteer opportunities
  30. 2006-06-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com: Re: [nylug-volunteers] Re: [nylug-talk] teaching volunteer opportunities]
  31. 2006-06-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Programming Jobs
  32. 2006-06-05 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-volunteers] Re: [nylug-talk] teaching volunteer opportunities
  33. 2006-06-05 MLR <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Palm 700P - You're Invited!]
  34. 2006-06-06 rc <ray-pub-at-rcn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Pizza Beer & AJAX in NYC Tuesday
  35. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS General Membership Meeting
  36. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?
  37. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [dha-at-panix.com: Re: Damian Conway in New York]
  38. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [joshua.mcadams-at-gmail.com: YAPC::NA]
  39. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLUG Social Meeting
  40. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Pizza Beer & AJAX in NYC Tuesday
  41. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] teaching volunteer opportunities
  42. 2006-06-06 WWWhatsup <joly-at-dti.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] 24 Hours to Save Internet Fair Use
  43. 2006-06-06 rc <ray-pub-at-rcn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Pizza Beer & AJAX in NYC Tuesday
  44. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] 24 Hours to Save Internet Fair Use
  45. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] 24 Hours to Save Internet Fair Use
  46. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?
  47. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [bruce.lai-at-council.nyc.ny.us: New York Times Editorial Supports for Universal Wi-Fi to Conquer Digital Divide in NYC.]
  48. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Pizza Beer & AJAX in NYC Tuesday
  49. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] 24 Hours to Save Internet Fair Use
  50. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] And GTK+
  51. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] GLIB announcement
  52. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [tpeters-at-mixcom.com: [MLUG] Linux demotivational posters]
  53. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?
  54. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?
  55. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [spacey-nylug-at-lenin.net: Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?]
  56. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com: Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?]
  57. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [phantom21-at-mindspring.com: Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?]
  58. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [dcrosta-at-sccs.swarthmore.edu: Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?]
  59. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com: [ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com: Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?]]
  60. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [dcrosta-at-sccs.swarthmore.edu: Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?]
  61. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?
  62. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?
  63. 2006-06-06 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?
  64. 2006-06-07 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?
  65. 2006-06-07 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [sunny-at-opencurve.org: [nylug-talk] Fwd: New York State Senate Democrats in need of 2 technologists]
  66. 2006-06-07 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [rguerin-at-nylug.org: [nylug-talk] [nylug-job] Branta Group Seeks contract System Admin/Data Center Operations Engineer]
  67. 2006-06-07 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Tonights Meeting - Hurray - Great Night
  68. 2006-06-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [ISOC-NY Discussion] PBS NOW - 'The Tangled Web'
  69. 2006-06-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Applw DRM Protest Saturday 6/10/06]
  70. 2006-06-08 myc <mlr52-at-mycouponmagic.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: Fwd: FW: 2005 Stella Awards
  71. 2006-06-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] a
  72. 2006-06-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: No Subject]
  73. 2006-06-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?
  74. 2006-06-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] "Wingfest" Vegetarian Style this Friday -at- 7:30pm
  75. 2006-06-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: rpm hell
  76. 2006-06-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Journal Commitments
  77. 2006-06-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: rpm hell
  78. 2006-06-08 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Bad News
  79. 2006-06-09 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Voice and the Web
  80. 2006-06-09 From: "mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Journal
  81. 2006-06-09 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [carenas2-at-alumni.gs.columbia.edu: Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?]
  82. 2006-06-09 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [dcrosta-at-sccs.swarthmore.edu: Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?]
  83. 2006-06-09 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Journal
  84. 2006-06-10 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.net> Re: [carenas2-at-alumni.gs.columbia.edu: Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?]
  85. 2006-06-10 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [carenas2-at-alumni.gs.columbia.edu: Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] PIG in new york?]
  86. 2006-06-10 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] Monday 12 June 2006 GNUbies: Antonio Perpinan of Codigo Libre on doing what you want to do with Free Software
  87. 2006-06-10 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Gnumbies Meeting
  88. 2006-06-10 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [rguerin-at-nylug.org: [nylug-talk] [nylug-job] Local Mid-Sized Company seeks SAMBA - LDAP Integration Consultant]
  89. 2006-06-10 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fair Use Article from Noel that we never published
  90. 2006-06-11 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: [CFSG-forum] Fwd: AAFE and CFSG youth technology show case]
  91. 2006-06-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] Potential space for Python Work Study Group
  92. 2006-06-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [selsok-at-yahoo.com: [CFSG-forum] Rev. with time AAFE and CFSG youth technology show case]
  93. 2006-06-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Web Server
  94. 2006-06-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Telephony
  95. 2006-06-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Journal
  96. 2006-06-12 From: "mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Journal
  97. 2006-06-12 WWWhatsup <joly-at-dti.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fwd: UK Report on "Digital Rights Management"
  98. 2006-06-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Telephony
  99. 2006-06-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fwd: UK Report on "Digital Rights Management"
  100. 2006-06-12 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [CandidateEmail-at-site.careerbuilder.com: CareerBuilder.com: Sr. Unix Developer]
  101. 2006-06-13 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] GNU/Linux 1 publishing
  102. 2006-06-13 From: "mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Gnubies Meeting
  103. 2006-06-13 From: "mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] textbook
  104. 2006-06-13 MLR <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: Book]
  105. 2006-06-13 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] Problems with GRUB
  106. 2006-06-13 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] textbook
  107. 2006-06-13 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Gnubies Meeting
  108. 2006-06-13 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Re: Book]
  109. 2006-06-13 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Gnubies Meeting
  110. 2006-06-13 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [rguerin-at-nylug.org: [nylug-talk] [nylug-job] Acadaca Internet Solutions seeks PHP Developer]
  111. 2006-06-13 ronny abraham <ronny.coder-at-gmail.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] bronx
  112. 2006-06-13 ronny abraham <ronny.coder-at-gmail.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] assembly workshop
  113. 2006-06-13 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] New NYLXS Website
  114. 2006-06-14 From: "mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] please repost Selso's thing tonight
  115. 2006-06-14 einker <eminker-at-gmail.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] selsok-at-yahoo.com: [CFSG-forum] Rev. with time AAFE and CFSG youth technology show case]
  116. 2006-06-14 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: Linux Sys Admin]
  117. 2006-06-14 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Fwd: [nylug-talk] [nylug-job] Shulman Fleming & Partners seeks
  118. 2006-06-14 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] selsok-at-yahoo.com: [CFSG-forum] Rev. with
  119. 2006-06-14 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: reference
  120. 2006-06-14 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: reference
  121. 2006-06-15 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Video Editing
  122. 2006-06-15 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Journal Status
  123. 2006-06-15 WWWhatsup <joly-at-dti.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Techweb intro to Linux
  124. 2006-06-15 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] enjoy
  125. 2006-06-15 ronny abraham <ronny.coder-at-gmail.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] enjoy
  126. 2006-06-16 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] General Memebership Meeting
  127. 2006-06-16 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] enjoy
  128. 2006-06-16 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [enviro-at-pilosoft.com: latest on drm/tv?]
  129. 2006-06-16 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] General Memebership Meeting
  130. 2006-06-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Wikipedia in the News
  131. 2006-06-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Slackware ISO's
  132. 2006-06-17 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] OP-ED - GNU/Windows
  133. 2006-06-18 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [rguerin-at-nylug.org: [nylug-talk] [nylug-job] Opsware seeks Senior Consulting Engineer]
  134. 2006-06-19 From: "mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fwd: [nylug-talk] [nylug-job] Opsware seeks Senior Consulting
  135. 2006-06-19 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Supervising Pharmacist Resignation
  136. 2006-06-19 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Meeting This Week
  137. 2006-06-19 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] DRM OP-ED in Boston
  138. 2006-06-19 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: [nylug-talk] Verizon price riot
  139. 2006-06-19 WWWhatsup <joly-at-dti.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: Senate Commerce Committee Communications Bill
  140. 2006-06-19 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: Senate Commerce Committee Communications Bill
  141. 2006-06-20 Ron Guerin <ron-at-vnetworx.net> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] TOMORROW! NY Linux Users Group Meeting 6/21: Francis Hwang on Ruby
  142. 2006-06-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] TOMORROW! NY Linux Users Group Meeting 6/21: Francis Hwang on Ruby Programming Language
  143. 2006-06-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Meeting This Week
  144. 2006-06-20 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [ron-at-vnetworx.net: [nylug-volunteers] Video/Audio help needed for the meeting tomorrow]
  145. 2006-06-21 From: "mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fwd: [nylug-talk] Array 12 drives
  146. 2006-06-21 From: "mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Fwd: Keep the Internet Free
  147. 2006-06-21 From: "mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com" <mlr52-at-michaellrichardson.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Journal
  148. 2006-06-21 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Blue Tooth Laptop
  149. 2006-06-21 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Programming Sysadmin position
  150. 2006-06-22 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Novell News
  151. 2006-06-22 einker <eminker-at-gmail.com> Fwd: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Novell News
  152. 2006-06-22 Ron Guerin <ron-at-vnetworx.net> Re: Fwd: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Novell News
  153. 2006-06-22 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Blue Tooth Laptop
  154. 2006-06-22 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Blue Tooth Laptop
  155. 2006-06-22 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: Fwd: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Novell News
  156. 2006-06-22 einker <eminker-at-gmail.com> Re: Fwd: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Novell News
  157. 2006-06-16 ronny abraham <ronny.coder-at-gmail.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] General Memebership Meeting
  158. 2006-06-23 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Blue Tooth Laptop
  159. 2006-06-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Human Thought
  160. 2006-06-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Blue Tooth Laptop
  161. 2006-06-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] The original Web
  162. 2006-06-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [tqs1757-at-nyu.edu: [ISOC-NY Discussion] Fight for a Free Press]
  163. 2006-06-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Network Nuetral
  164. 2006-06-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Legistlative front
  165. 2006-06-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Entertainment Japanese style
  166. 2006-06-23 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Entertainment Japanese style
  167. 2006-06-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Re: Bill Gates committing piracy on the internet
  168. 2006-06-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Entertainment Japanese style
  169. 2006-06-23 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Entertainment Japanese style
  170. 2006-06-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Entertainment Japanese style
  171. 2006-06-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [rguerin-at-nylug.org: [nylug-talk] [nylug-job] San Antonio Company seeks Linux Systems Administrator]
  172. 2006-06-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] NYLXS Going Off Line for a few days
  173. 2006-06-23 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Only the Good Die young
  174. 2006-06-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] While NYLXS going off the air for a few days is not the end of the world....
  175. 2006-06-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] Almost Real
  176. 2006-06-24 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] jobs
  177. 2006-06-25 Ruben Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [NYLXS - HANGOUT] [Hardhats-members] Pharmacy snafu ... enforced dosing schedules]

NYLXS are Do'ers and the first step of Doing is Joining! Join NYLXS and make a difference in your community today!