|FROM ||Ruben Safir
|SUBJECT ||Subject: [Hangout - NYLXS] (fwd) Re: Human & ape evolution
|-- forwarded message --
X-Received: by 2002:a05:620a:470c:b0:757:9fb8:3509 with SMTP id bs12-20020a05620a470c00b007579fb83509mr5498809qkb.10.1684090831660;
Sun, 14 May 2023 12:00:31 -0700 (PDT)
X-Received: by 2002:a4a:c986:0:b0:54f:d1e1:34bb with SMTP id
u6-20020a4ac986000000b0054fd1e134bbmr4689194ooq.1.1684090831348; Sun, 14 May
2023 12:00:31 -0700 (PDT)
Date: Sun, 14 May 2023 12:00:31 -0700 (PDT)
Injection-Info: google-groups.googlegroups.com; posting-host=126.96.36.199; posting-account=pysjKgkAAACLegAdYDFznkqjgx_7vlUK
Subject: Re: Human & ape evolution
Injection-Date: Sun, 14 May 2023 19:00:31 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
Xref: panix sci.bio.paleontology:77320
On Sunday, 14 May 2023 at 08:49:46 UTC+3, JTEM wrote:
> oot...-at-hot.ee wrote:
> > You *are* parroting there groundless H.P. Lowecraft fan-fiction by
> You sound like an idiot trying very hard not to sound like an idiot.
Do not mirror.
> > It started from African woodland apes.
> That's a conclusion i.e. "circular reasoning."
> Seems that we should be the furthest away, genetically, from the FIRST
> so called apes to peel off from us, and the closest genetically to the
> most recent of the so called apes to peel off from our line. Well the Chimps
> are the closest and they're in Africa. Orangutans are way over in Asia.
The monkeys indeed evolved and migrated. We do not discuss origins of
ape, but origins of Homo. Pierolapithecus was after split from Orangutang
likely closer to our ancestors than Orangutang and clearly not Homo nor
there's nothing aquatic about it. Theory of marc that Homo somehow
evolved from Orangutang is therefore void.
> > We see Pre-Oldowan woodland ape
> > tools in Africa from 3.3 mya.
> Speculation. We see broken rocks. In some instances it has been claimed
> that BILLIONS upon BILLIONS of broken rocks, in a single site, are tools.
> They do not have a good record here...
No idea what rocks you mean here. Just random denial?
> > Oldowan tools (and butchered hippos) in Africa from 2.9 mya.
> Not associated with Homo, if the claims hold up.
> It's not a fact that they even are tools.
But no one claims that there was Homo 2.9 mya. It was likely ancestor
of Homo as lot of Homo kept using very similar tools more than million years
later in parallel with Acheulean tools.
That ancestor was clearly living in woodland, did kill hippos and butchered
those. And before you ask, no, no one claims that it ate only hippos and
> > The later Acheulean tools we see similarly starting from 1.76 mya East
> > Africa and then spreading to elsewhere slowly between 1.5 mya to 0.8
> > mya.
> They were already in China BEYOND 2 million years ago, and they weren't
> first-generation tools.
Nope, there no so old Acheulean tools in China. Oldest are 2.1mya Oldowan
tools in the southern Chinese Loess plateau. The favorite of marc Java had
Oldowan tools 1.8 mya. Oldest Acheulean tools in Asia are from South India
> And how did "Woodland Apes" spread from a corner in Africa to Europe,
> Asia and beyond?
But what is the problem? There were likely forests everywhere. If not
always then during million of years there are long humid periods. Sahara was
grassland only recently for at least 10,000 years until 5,000 years ago. We
talk about hundreds of times longer timescale.
Apes evolved into Homo that did walk upright and did climb trees. The
h.erectus was capable to make Oldowan tools, carry weapons and food
long distances. Some even claim leather clothes, bags, rafting and control
of fire but evidence of it is low. But it clearly spread relatively quickly all
over the warm climate woodlands on both continents ~2 mya.
> Where did they get the DHA their brains needed?
Lack of DHA is problem only for one-sided cereal, margarine and corn syrup
eaters. Our ancestors did not eat such garbage. They ate meat, eggs,
nuts, termite grubs, seeds, fish and fruit. For catching spawning fish in some
forest brook there was no need to be aquatic nor very wise. Bear, cat and
fox do it why not ape with spears and traps? Otter and seal eat fish all the
time do they have large brain? One grows bigger brain for when there is
need/benefit to have one, not because they eat fish.
> Why do we find what looks like Ardi/Lucy teeth in Europe 10 million years
No one claims that there were no apes in Europe or Asia 10 mya. Genetic
evidence, fossils and findings of tools show that Homo evolved from African
apes. Oldest fossil that is called "Homo" is h.habilis 2.31 mya in Africa.
Ancestors of said apes could migrate to Africa from Europe 13-10
mya or later, I do not know, and it is not even discussed here. Homo evolved
about ten millions years later. The fossils are not aquatic apes or nonsense
"aquarboreal" apes but forest apes. That "aquarboreal" seems to mean
someone who either wades in water or climbs trees but for undisclosed
reasons avoids walking on dry land? Do you buy that? I may be mistaken
as marc verhaegen's bullshit is mostly in Dutch, is jumping between events that
are several millions of years apart. Word salad about not running in savanna.
Homo were likely never half as fast runners as bear (who hates to run). Do
bears run in savanna? No. But if bear does not run in savanna then it likely
dives and wades? Also no. How it survives without using neither of "two allowed"
options of marc verhaegen?
-- end of forwarded message --
Hangout mailing list