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DATE 2003-08-01

HANGOUT

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Key: Value:

Key: Value:

MESSAGE
DATE 2003-08-19
FROM From: "Inker, Evan"
SUBJECT Subject: [hangout] DistroWatch Weekly, Issue 11, 18 August 2003

SuSE's dangerous arrogance

In two recent interviews with popular technology publications, SuSE's CEO
Richard Seibt chose to demonstrate a high degree of arrogance. In response
to CRN's question about Windows to Linux migration, Seibt insisted that
"Linux means two companies: Red Hat and SuSE, and nobody else." In another
interview for ZDNet, the suggestion that choice meant more than the two
alternatives met with another strong denial from Seibt: "If you ask [the
hardware vendors], they will tell you they want to support two
distributions." While in the context of the topics discussed these
statements sounded more like "wishful thinking", rather than solid facts,
they also represent a dangerous shift in the world of commercial Linux
distributions - from peaceful coexistence with other Linux vendors and
communities to a cut-throat, Microsoft-like way of competing, where facts
and truths are less important that profit margins and elimination of any
competing product at all cost.

First, let's get the facts straight. SuSE is nowhere near to being the
second most widely used Linux distribution in the world. Granted, there are
no reliable statistics to prove it, but of the many polls that occasionally
appear on popular web sites, SuSE rarely does well. Take this recent
Slashdot poll as a good example. Slashdot is of course an enormously popular
web site, which has the ability to generate tens of thousands of votes in a
few hours, but of the distributions presented in this one, SuSE, with 7% of
all votes, only succeeded in beating Conectiva and Linux From Scratch. Our
own page hit ranking, which is essentially a long-term poll of visitors'
interest, SuSE is well behind Red Hat, Mandrake, Gentoo and Debian, and only
very slightly above Slackware. Moreover, German visitors browsing
DistroWatch visit the Mandrake and Red Hat pages more often than the SuSE
page. Another interesting indication of SuSE's acceptance came to light
earlier this year when we were looking for a dedicated server hosting
DistroWatch. While about 95% of web hosting companies offer Red Hat as the
only Linux choice and the remaining 5% also offer Debian and/or Slackware,
of the 200 or so hosting companies we looked at, none offered SuSE as a
choice of OS.

SuSE has several other things going against it. Firstly, there is little
doubt that SuSE's reluctance to provide ISO images for download limits its
exposure. Worse, SuSE is very selective about its markets and although it is
well accepted in large parts of Europe and North America, there is the vast
Asian continent where SuSE is virtually unknown. Secondly, many US-based
journalists seem to be of the opinion that SuSE is a dominant distribution
in Europe, while ignoring substantial parts of the old continent, such as
the Spanish provinces of Extremadura and Andalusia, which have exclusively
deployed Debian-based LinEx in all of their public administration offices as
well as schools. A similar effort is under way in Norway with Skolelinux,
which is also Debian-based. This point is not to be underestimated - we are
not talking about a few dozens of computers in companies that can afford the
expensive SuSE Desktop licenses - we are talking about tens, if not hundreds
of thousands of Debian-based systems, with no other operating system on
them! Now, this is the true success story, which SuSE will not match in
hundred years, Mr Seibt!

Thirdly, SuSE's refusal to include general public in its beta testing is
another sore point. If you have ever experienced the spirit on Red Hat's and
Mandrake's mailing lists during their respective beta testing periods, than
you know the feeling - being part of the process, talking to the developers,
seeing the bugs fixed in front of your eyes - all these experiences provide
not only valuable lessons for all who take part, they also create an
emotional attachment to the distribution one helped to test and debug. A
distribution is not just a box with media and manuals in it, it is a
process. The regular distribution flame wars on public forums are prove that
we do get attached to a our favourite operating system.

Unfortunately, it seems likely that the wide acceptance of Linux will
undermine the purity of the original ideals that have initiated its
development. Yes, profits are important. Yes, there should be companies that
benefit from Linux so that they can contribute to its continued prosperity.
But is it necessary to resort to dirty tricks and outright lies? Is
arrogance of top executives of commercial Linux companies slowly becoming
the order of the day? I certainly hope not, Mr Seibt.


Regards,

Evan M. Inker (New York) x. 4615



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  1. 2003-08-02 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] please excuse this spam
  2. 2003-08-02 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] NYLXS has had a death in the family
  3. 2003-08-01 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Meeting Tonight
  4. 2003-08-01 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Tech Night Idea's
  5. 2003-08-01 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Tech Night Idea's
  6. 2003-08-01 Ron Guerin <ron-at-vnetworx.net> Re: [hangout] please excuse this spam
  7. 2003-08-01 From: "akbar pasha" <akbar-at-pionerd.org> Subject: [hangout] [OT] perl q/ideas?
  8. 2003-08-25 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Biggest Free Softwaree Chamber of Commerce Meeting of the Year
  9. 2003-08-25 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Biggest Free Softwaree Chamber of Commerce Meeting of the Year
  10. 2003-08-25 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] The work force transforms, creating new challenges for federal ma
  11. 2003-08-25 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] FW: must see this
  12. 2003-08-25 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> Subject: [hangout] FW: must see this
  13. 2003-08-24 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Editing an MP3
  14. 2003-08-24 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Novell Bets on Linux
  15. 2003-08-23 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] GNOME Developers Summit
  16. 2003-08-23 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] GNOME Developers Sumit
  17. 2003-08-23 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] GNOME Developers Sumit
  18. 2003-08-23 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [jobs-admin-at-perl.org: [Perl Jobs] mod_perl / DBI developer for web projects (telecommute), Australia, Queensland, Brisbane]
  19. 2003-08-23 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] GNOME Developers Sumit
  20. 2003-08-23 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] GNOME Developers Sumit
  21. 2003-08-23 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] GNOME Developers Sumit
  22. 2003-08-23 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Volunteer needed to take press photo's
  23. 2003-08-23 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] GNOME Developers Sumit
  24. 2003-08-22 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [GeoBear-at-geobop.com: Freedomware Campaign]
  25. 2003-08-22 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] I take it back - I;m not banned from NYLUG
  26. 2003-08-22 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] NYLGU list
  27. 2003-08-22 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] GNOME CONFERENCE MINUTES
  28. 2003-08-22 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] irc
  29. 2003-08-22 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] irc
  30. 2003-08-22 From: "Ray C." <ray-pub-at-nyc.rr.com> Re: [hangout] Help moving stuff
  31. 2003-08-22 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Novell Bets on Linux
  32. 2003-08-22 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Some Interesting News this weel
  33. 2003-08-22 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> Subject: [hangout] Volunteers needed
  34. 2003-08-22 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] NYLXS is Breathign Again Easily
  35. 2003-08-22 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Re: [nylug-talk] DRM is Theft
  36. 2003-08-21 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] IRC NOW
  37. 2003-08-21 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: [nylug-talk] DRM is Theft
  38. 2003-08-21 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] DRM is Theft
  39. 2003-08-21 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] NYLXS Organizing the GNOME Developers Conference
  40. 2003-08-21 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] NYLXS Organizing the GNOME Developers Conference
  41. 2003-08-21 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Novell Bets on Linux
  42. 2003-08-21 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> Subject: [hangout] Help moving stuff
  43. 2003-08-21 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Felten, 08/28/03
  44. 2003-08-21 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] NYLXS Organizing the GNOME Developers Conference
  45. 2003-08-21 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] NYLXS Organizing the GNOME Developers Conference
  46. 2003-08-21 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> Subject: [hangout] Playtime
  47. 2003-08-21 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] How does this work?
  48. 2003-08-21 Bob Butcher <rwbutcher-at-yahoo.com> RE: [hangout] How does this work?
  49. 2003-08-21 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] How does this work?
  50. 2003-08-21 Bob Butcher <rwbutcher-at-yahoo.com> Subject: [hangout] How does this work?
  51. 2003-08-21 From: "David Sugar" <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] NYLXS Organizing the GNOME Developers Conference
  52. 2003-08-20 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] Felten, 08/28/03
  53. 2003-08-20 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Board Orientation
  54. 2003-08-20 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Felten, 08/28/03
  55. 2003-08-20 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] NYLXS Organizing the GNOME Developers Conference
  56. 2003-08-20 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [jobs-admin-at-perl.org: [Perl Jobs] LAMP+XML developer (onsite), United States, DC, Washington]
  57. 2003-08-20 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [jobs-admin-at-perl.org: [Perl Jobs] Senior Engineer / Analyst (onsite), United States, MA, Cambridge
  58. 2003-08-20 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] Laptops for All
  59. 2003-08-20 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Re: [hangout] Laptops for All
  60. 2003-08-20 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Democracy and the Information Revolution
  61. 2003-08-20 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Connecting Kids to Technology: Challenges and Opportunities
  62. 2003-08-20 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Laptops for All
  63. 2003-08-20 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] Crossfire client for OSX...
  64. 2003-08-20 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Subject: [hangout] Felten, 08/28/03
  65. 2003-08-20 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Two on Backfire of SCO's "Smoking Gun"
  66. 2003-08-20 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] SAMBA News (19th Aug, 2003) SCO use of Samba code u
  67. 2003-08-20 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] NYLXS' materials
  68. 2003-08-20 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] SCO users divided over GPL
  69. 2003-08-20 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Readers respond: SCO's McBride doesn't speak for IT in IBM fight
  70. 2003-08-20 From: "akbar pasha" <akbar-at-pionerd.org> Re: [hangout] Nothing is Forever
  71. 2003-08-20 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] SAMBA News (19th Aug, 2003) SCO use of Samba code under the GPL
  72. 2003-08-20 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] NYLXS' materials
  73. 2003-08-20 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] IBM Article: Use the /proc filesystem to get a han
  74. 2003-08-20 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Nothing is Forever
  75. 2003-08-20 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] NYLXS Board Minutes
  76. 2003-08-20 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Nothing is Forever
  77. 2003-08-19 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Wednesday Night Gnome Development Meeting
  78. 2003-08-19 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] NYLXS' materials
  79. 2003-08-19 From: "Ray C." <ray-pub-at-nyc.rr.com> Subject: [hangout] NYLXS' materials
  80. 2003-08-19 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] IBM Article: Use the /proc filesystem to get a handle on your sy
  81. 2003-08-19 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] DistroWatch/SuSe arrogance.
  82. 2003-08-19 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] GNOME summit update and Kings Games on Wednesday
  83. 2003-08-19 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] CRN Interview: SuSE Linux CEO / Face to Face Richard Seibt SuSE's CEO
  84. 2003-08-19 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] GNOME summit update and Kings Games on Wednesday
  85. 2003-08-19 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] DistroWatch Weekly, Issue 11, 18 August 2003
  86. 2003-08-19 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] GNOME summit update and Kings Games on Wednesday
  87. 2003-08-18 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Fwd: [Perl Jobs] mod_perl/Linux Software Engineer for SSL VPN Leader (onsite), United States, New Jersey [jobs-admin-at-perl.org]
  88. 2003-08-18 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Subject: [hangout] GNOME summit update and Kings Games on Wednesday
  89. 2003-08-18 Robert Marino <prmarino-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [hangout] Operating Systems...
  90. 2003-08-18 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: Guadec 5
  91. 2003-08-18 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Subject: [hangout] GUADEC REPORT: The counter proposal from the GNOME board...
  92. 2003-08-17 Jacek Blizinski <azidog-at-nyc.rr.com> Re: [hangout] Safe to read.
  93. 2003-08-17 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] Safe to read.
  94. 2003-08-17 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Weekly NYLXS Announcments
  95. 2003-08-17 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] EULA Law
  96. 2003-08-17 NYLUG NYLUG <nylug-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Weekly NYLXS Announcments
  97. 2003-08-17 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  98. 2003-08-17 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] Ultra..
  99. 2003-08-17 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: General membership and board meeting
  100. 2003-08-17 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  101. 2003-08-17 From: "Ray C." <ray-pub-at-nyc.rr.com> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  102. 2003-08-16 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] Ultraleftism.
  103. 2003-08-16 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] Operating Systems...
  104. 2003-08-16 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] OS/2/IBM/Banks.
  105. 2003-08-16 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  106. 2003-08-16 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  107. 2003-08-16 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  108. 2003-08-16 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Wiki (fwd)
  109. 2003-08-16 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  110. 2003-08-16 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  111. 2003-08-16 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  112. 2003-08-16 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Wiki (fwd)
  113. 2003-08-16 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Wiki (fwd)
  114. 2003-08-16 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  115. 2003-08-16 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  116. 2003-08-16 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] Satellite that was knocked out a few years ago.
  117. 2003-08-16 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] crossfire tonight?
  118. 2003-08-15 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] crossfire tonight?
  119. 2003-08-15 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  120. 2003-08-15 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  121. 2003-08-15 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] Welcome back.
  122. 2003-08-15 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] GNOME foundation seeks host city for Guadec 5
  123. 2003-08-15 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  124. 2003-08-15 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Where were you when the lights went off?
  125. 2003-08-14 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] more GNOME foundation seeks host city for Guadec 5
  126. 2003-08-14 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] GNOME foundation seeks host city for Guadec 5
  127. 2003-08-14 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] GNOME foundation seeks host city for Guadec 5
  128. 2003-08-14 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] GNOME foundation seeks host city for Guadec 5
  129. 2003-08-13 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Re: [hangout] GNOME foundation seeks host city for Guadec 5
  130. 2003-08-13 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM and banking
  131. 2003-08-13 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] IBM and banking
  132. 2003-08-13 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Re: [hangout] Fwd: [NMLUG] OT Law. (fwd)
  133. 2003-08-13 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Fwd: [NMLUG] OT Law. (fwd)
  134. 2003-08-13 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  135. 2003-08-13 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  136. 2003-08-13 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Fwd: #357: Pipes in NYPost on "The Terrorist Next Door" (Hawash case) [dplist-at-danielpipes.org]
  137. 2003-08-13 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  138. 2003-08-13 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Fwd: [NMLUG] OT Law. (fwd)
  139. 2003-08-13 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  140. 2003-08-13 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] More Interesting Holes in MS
  141. 2003-08-13 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Fwd: Your Linux Today Security Letter for August 13, 2003 [reply-478d-1808-2f6b114cd7-at-nl.internet.com]
  142. 2003-08-13 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] GNOME foundation seeks host city for Guadec 5
  143. 2003-08-13 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] Fwd: [NMLUG] OT Law. (fwd)
  144. 2003-08-13 Billy <billy-at-dadadada.net> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  145. 2003-08-13 Sunny Dubey <dubeys-at-bxscience.edu> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  146. 2003-08-13 Ron Guerin <ron-at-vnetworx.net> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  147. 2003-08-13 David Sugar <dyfet-at-ostel.com> Subject: [hangout] GNOME foundation seeks host city for Guadec 5
  148. 2003-08-13 Ron Guerin <ron-at-vnetworx.net> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  149. 2003-08-12 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Fwd: [NMLUG] OT Law. (fwd)
  150. 2003-08-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Re: [hangout] Fwd: [NMLUG] OT Law. (fwd)
  151. 2003-08-12 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Fwd: [NMLUG] OT Law. (fwd)
  152. 2003-08-12 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] Fwd: [NMLUG] OT Law. (fwd)
  153. 2003-08-12 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] General membership and board meeting
  154. 2003-08-11 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] Killarney Rose arises from the Ashes.....
  155. 2003-08-11 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Killarney Rose arises from the Ashes.....
  156. 2003-08-10 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Tech Night continues
  157. 2003-08-10 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Weekly NYLXS Announcments
  158. 2003-08-10 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Weekly NYLXS Announcments
  159. 2003-08-10 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [jobs-admin-at-perl.org: [Perl Jobs] Perl/ASP Developer (telecommute), United States, Texas, Austin]
  160. 2003-08-09 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] How is this for FUD.
  161. 2003-08-08 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Re: [hangout] IBM counter sues SCO
  162. 2003-08-08 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM counter sues SCO
  163. 2003-08-08 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Lindows continues its PC push
  164. 2003-08-08 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] IBM counter sues SCO
  165. 2003-08-08 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] IBM counter sues SCO
  166. 2003-08-08 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] Lindows continues its PC push
  167. 2003-08-08 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] Lindows continues its PC push
  168. 2003-08-08 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Lycoris Users Immune to SCO Licensing
  169. 2003-08-08 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] Lindows continues its PC push
  170. 2003-08-08 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Lindows continues its PC push
  171. 2003-08-08 Ron Guerin <ron-at-vnetworx.net> Re: [hangout] IBM countersues SCO
  172. 2003-08-08 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] IBM countersues SCO
  173. 2003-08-08 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Need info on Microsofts licensing tactics.
  174. 2003-08-08 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] Need info on Microsofts licensing tactics.
  175. 2003-08-07 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] [lordvolton-at-yahoo.com: Re: Your legal rights against SCO.]
  176. 2003-08-07 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] IBM countersues SCO
  177. 2003-08-07 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] IBM countersues SCO
  178. 2003-08-07 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] This could be a problem.
  179. 2003-08-07 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [lordvolton-at-yahoo.com: Re: Your legal rights against SCO.]
  180. 2003-08-06 Joe Grastara <joe-at-endeavor.med.nyu.edu> Subject: [hangout] Help Editing
  181. 2003-08-06 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] Progress on Mandrake G4 install.
  182. 2003-08-06 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Meeting Tonight?
  183. 2003-08-06 Contrarian <adrba-at-nyct.net> Re: [hangout] Editors Needed Imediately - available
  184. 2003-08-06 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Re:Crossfire Server
  185. 2003-08-06 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Re: [hangout] Re:Crossfire Server
  186. 2003-08-05 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Meeting
  187. 2003-08-05 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Meeting
  188. 2003-08-05 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Meeting
  189. 2003-08-05 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Re:Crossfire Server
  190. 2003-08-05 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Perl Job: United States, NJ, Trenton
  191. 2003-08-05 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Re: [hangout] Re:Crossfire Server
  192. 2003-08-05 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Re: [hangout] Re:Crossfire Server
  193. 2003-08-05 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Re:Crossfire Server
  194. 2003-08-05 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Re:Crossfire Server
  195. 2003-08-05 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Re: [hangout] Idea for NYLXS.
  196. 2003-08-05 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Re: [hangout] Idea for NYLXS.
  197. 2003-08-05 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] Idea for NYLXS.
  198. 2003-08-05 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] Idea for NYLXS.
  199. 2003-08-05 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] Re:Crossfire Server
  200. 2003-08-05 Joe Grastara <joe-at-endeavor.med.nyu.edu> Re: [hangout] Editors Needed Imediately
  201. 2003-08-04 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Crossfire Server
  202. 2003-08-04 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] KDE security questions.
  203. 2003-08-04 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Re: [hangout] KDE security questions.
  204. 2003-08-04 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] NYLXS JOURNAL
  205. 2003-08-04 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: [learn] Editors Needed Imediately
  206. 2003-08-04 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Editors Needed Imediately
  207. 2003-08-04 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Novell Acquires Ximian
  208. 2003-08-04 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] need a person for PHP & MySQL project
  209. 2003-08-04 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [jobs-admin-at-perl.org: [Perl Jobs] DBI/CGI Programmer (onsite), United States, NY, New York]
  210. 2003-08-04 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] KDE security questions.
  211. 2003-08-04 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] re:I want to learn linux
  212. 2003-08-04 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] RedHat sues SCO for deceptive business practices.
  213. 2003-08-04 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Red Hat fires back at SCO in Linux fight
  214. 2003-08-04 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] It may have been for naught...
  215. 2003-08-04 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] It may have been for naught...
  216. 2003-08-04 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] OpenOffice...
  217. 2003-08-04 From: "J L" <lokokool-at-hotmail.com> Subject: [hangout] re:I want to learn linux
  218. 2003-08-04 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] I want to learn linux
  219. 2003-08-04 From: "J L" <lokokool-at-hotmail.com> Subject: [hangout] I want to learn linux
  220. 2003-08-04 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] KDE security questions.
  221. 2003-08-04 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Re: RE: [hangout] KDE security questions.
  222. 2003-08-04 From: "Steve Milo" <slavik914-at-rennlist.com> Subject: [hangout] KDE security questions.
  223. 2003-08-04 From: "Dimitar Georgievski" <dimitarg-at-websyn.com> Subject: [hangout] need a person for PHP & MySQL project
  224. 2003-08-04 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] Paging Rob and Evan
  225. 2003-08-04 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] Road Trip
  226. 2003-08-04 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Paging Rob and Evan
  227. 2003-08-04 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Novell Acquires Ximian
  228. 2003-08-04 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Road Trip
  229. 2003-08-04 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> Subject: [hangout] Road Trip
  230. 2003-08-04 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] Novell Acquires Ximian
  231. 2003-08-04 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [krahmer-at-suse.de: [suse-security-announce] SuSE Security Announcement: postfix (SuSE-SA:2003:033)]
  232. 2003-08-03 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Tech Night
  233. 2003-08-03 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] a question about network.
  234. 2003-08-03 akbar pasha <akbar-at-pionerd.org> Subject: [hangout] a question about network.
  235. 2003-08-03 From: "Ray C." <ray-pub-at-nyc.rr.com> Subject: [hangout] My Present Situation
  236. 2003-08-03 akbar pasha <akbar-at-pionerd.org> Subject: [hangout] [Fwd: [Perl Jobs] Perl developer (onsite), United States, Ny, Brooklyn]
  237. 2003-08-03 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [Fwd: Re: [nylug-talk] Death in The Family] (fwd)
  238. 2003-08-03 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Radio Show tonite
  239. 2003-08-02 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Tech Nite: The continuing saga of greatness
  240. 2003-08-02 Adam Kosmin <akosmin-at-nyc.rr.com> Re: [hangout] Death in The Family
  241. 2003-08-02 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Death in The Family
  242. 2003-08-31 Steve Milo <slavik914-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Video of the Meeting
  243. 2003-08-31 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Video of the Meeting
  244. 2003-08-30 Adam Kosmin <akosmin-at-nyc.rr.com> Subject: [hangout] freshrpms.net
  245. 2003-08-30 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Video of the Meeting
  246. 2003-08-30 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: [nylug-talk] DRM is Theft
  247. 2003-08-29 Steve Milo <slavik914-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Interesting article on Valenti in this months Business2.0.
  248. 2003-08-29 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] No plans to sue Linux companies, says SCO
  249. 2003-08-29 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Re: [fairuse] DRM is Theft
  250. 2003-08-29 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] No plans to sue Linux companies, says SCO
  251. 2003-08-29 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] No plans to sue Linux companies, says SCO
  252. 2003-08-29 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> Subject: [hangout] RE: [fairuse] DRM is Theft
  253. 2003-08-29 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] DRM is Theft
  254. 2003-08-28 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> RE: [hangout] NY Fair Use ==> NYACSH switch other
  255. 2003-08-28 Steve Milo <slavik914-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Gimp book (online)
  256. 2003-08-28 Adam Kosmin <akosmin-at-nyc.rr.com> Subject: [hangout] Gimp book (online)
  257. 2003-08-28 Steve Milo <slavik914-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] NY Fair Use ==> NYACSH switch other
  258. 2003-08-28 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] NY Fair Use ==> NYACSH switch other
  259. 2003-08-28 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] NY Fair Use ==> NYACSH switch other
  260. 2003-08-28 Steve Milo <slavik914-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] NY Fair Use ==> NYACSH switch other
  261. 2003-08-28 akbar <akbar-at-pionerd.org> Subject: [hangout] head first java
  262. 2003-08-28 akbar <akbar-at-pionerd.org> RE: [hangout] NY Fair Use ==> NYACSH switch other
  263. 2003-08-28 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Whirlwindstate-at-aol.com: Fwd: MY Group Show " 9-11 Remembered"
  264. 2003-08-28 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] Flyers for Classes
  265. 2003-08-28 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Flyers for Classes
  266. 2003-08-28 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] NY Fair Use ==> NYACSH switch other
  267. 2003-08-28 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] Flyers for Classes
  268. 2003-08-28 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Staten Island Events
  269. 2003-08-28 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] NY Fair Use ==> NYACSH switch other
  270. 2003-08-28 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Flyers for Classes
  271. 2003-08-27 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] GNOME COnference
  272. 2003-08-27 Ruben I Safir <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] Edit mp3
  273. 2003-08-27 Mike Richardson - NYLXS PRESIDENT <miker-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] GNOME development summit approved
  274. 2003-08-27 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] GNOME development summit approved
  275. 2003-08-27 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] Last Nights Meeting
  276. 2003-08-27 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] scanner needed
  277. 2003-08-27 Adam Kosmin <akosmin-at-nyc.rr.com> Subject: [hangout] scanner needed
  278. 2003-08-27 Charles Nardino <cnardino-at-bway.net> Subject: [hangout] Edit mp3
  279. 2003-08-26 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] [thomas-at-suse.de: [suse-security-announce] SuSE Security Announcement: sendmail (SuSE-SA:2003:035)]
  280. 2003-08-26 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Re: [hangout] PR for tonight
  281. 2003-08-26 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] PR for tonight
  282. 2003-08-26 Joe Grastara <joe-at-endeavor.med.nyu.edu> RE: [hangout] PR for tonight
  283. 2003-08-26 Joe Grastara <jfg205-at-nyu.edu> Subject: [hangout] PR for tonight
  284. 2003-08-26 Michael Richardson <MRICHARDSON-at-abc.state.ny.us> RE: [hangout] PR for tonight
  285. 2003-08-26 Ruben Safir Secretary NYLXS <ruben-at-mrbrklyn.com> Subject: [hangout] COnsulting Oppurtunity with US Gov
  286. 2003-08-29 Ron Guerin <ron-at-vnetworx.net> RE: [hangout] No plans to sue Linux companies, says SCO
  287. 2003-08-29 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> RE: [hangout] No plans to sue Linux companies, says SCO
  288. 2003-08-29 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] No plans to sue Linux companies, says SCO
  289. 2003-08-27 From: "Inker, Evan" <EInker-at-gam.com> Subject: [hangout] FSCC Meeting - Tues Aug 26, 2003
  290. 2003-08-20 From: "Ray C." <ray-pub-at-nyc.rr.com> Re: [hangout] NYLXS' materials
  291. 2003-08-17 Sunny Dubey <dubeys-at-bxscience.edu> Re: [hangout] Ultraleftism.
  292. 2003-08-17 Sunny Dubey <dubeys-at-bxscience.edu> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  293. 2003-08-16 Sunny Dubey <dubeys-at-bxscience.edu> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  294. 2003-08-16 Sunny Dubey <dubeys-at-bxscience.edu> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  295. 2003-08-15 Sunny Dubey <dubeys-at-bxscience.edu> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  296. 2003-08-14 Sunny Dubey <dubeys-at-bxscience.edu> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path
  297. 2003-08-14 Sunny Dubey <dubeys-at-bxscience.edu> Re: [hangout] IBM, Bankers at Odds Over OS/2 Migration Path

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